What do linearly ordered abelian groups look like?

Clash Royale CLAN TAG#URR8PPP
up vote
20
down vote
favorite
Recently a post on MathOverflow connected a theorem about ordered abelian groups to the axiom of choice, and it made me want to try and play with these objects a bit.
But it appears to me that I don't know enough about linearly ordered abelian groups. In particular I am interested in the structure of their Archimedean classes. Let's establish some ad-hoc terminology first. Let $(G,+,leq)$ be a linearly ordered abelian group.
- $gin G$ is positive if $g>0$.
- The absolute value of $g$ is $|g|=maxg,-g$.
- If $g,hin G$ then $gsim h$ if and only if $|h|leq|g|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|g|leq n|h|$; or $|g|leq|h|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|h|leq n|g|$.
- An Archimedean class of $G$ is an equivalence class of $sim$. $Gamma(G)$ is the set of equivalence classes, and $preceq$ is the natural ordered induced from $leq$. If $[g],[h]inGamma(G)$ then $[g]preceq[h]$ if and only if $|g|leq|h|$ or $gsim h$.
- If $gin G$ then the positive part of the Archimedean class of $g$ is the set $hin Gmid hsim gland h>0$.
- If $G$ is an ordered group, an Archimedean extension is a group $K$ such that $Gleq K$, and $Gamma(G)=Gamma(K)$. If $G$ has no [nontrivial] Archimedean extensions we say that $G$ is Archimedean complete.
In "Ordered Abelian Groups", Gravett points out that given an ordered group $G$, we can replace it with a "rational group" $G^*$ such that every $xin G^*$ has some $n$ such that $nxin G$ (I believe this is "divisible group" in modern terms, and $G^*$ is the injective hull of $G$). It is quite clear that this rational group is a vector space over $Bbb Q$, and that it is an Archimedean extension of $G$.
So we can assume that an ordered group is a linearly ordered vector space over the rationals.
My questions are:
What do Archimedean classes of an ordered group look like? Are they isomorphic to subgroups of $Bbb R$ (or the positive parts, to subgroups of $Bbb R^+$)?
If not, what sort of counterexamples can we find?
Gravett proves the Hahn completeness theorem which states that a group $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is isomorphic to its Hahn group (which is $Bbb R^Gamma(G)$ where the exponentiation is similar to ordinal exponentiation). Can we conclude in that case that $G$ is actually an ordered vector space over $Bbb R$?
Can we prove that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is a vector space over $Bbb R$? Does this mean that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $Bbb R$ (or the positive part to the positive reals), or is this a separate fact that we can prove?
group-theory order-theory
 |Â
show 3 more comments
up vote
20
down vote
favorite
Recently a post on MathOverflow connected a theorem about ordered abelian groups to the axiom of choice, and it made me want to try and play with these objects a bit.
But it appears to me that I don't know enough about linearly ordered abelian groups. In particular I am interested in the structure of their Archimedean classes. Let's establish some ad-hoc terminology first. Let $(G,+,leq)$ be a linearly ordered abelian group.
- $gin G$ is positive if $g>0$.
- The absolute value of $g$ is $|g|=maxg,-g$.
- If $g,hin G$ then $gsim h$ if and only if $|h|leq|g|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|g|leq n|h|$; or $|g|leq|h|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|h|leq n|g|$.
- An Archimedean class of $G$ is an equivalence class of $sim$. $Gamma(G)$ is the set of equivalence classes, and $preceq$ is the natural ordered induced from $leq$. If $[g],[h]inGamma(G)$ then $[g]preceq[h]$ if and only if $|g|leq|h|$ or $gsim h$.
- If $gin G$ then the positive part of the Archimedean class of $g$ is the set $hin Gmid hsim gland h>0$.
- If $G$ is an ordered group, an Archimedean extension is a group $K$ such that $Gleq K$, and $Gamma(G)=Gamma(K)$. If $G$ has no [nontrivial] Archimedean extensions we say that $G$ is Archimedean complete.
In "Ordered Abelian Groups", Gravett points out that given an ordered group $G$, we can replace it with a "rational group" $G^*$ such that every $xin G^*$ has some $n$ such that $nxin G$ (I believe this is "divisible group" in modern terms, and $G^*$ is the injective hull of $G$). It is quite clear that this rational group is a vector space over $Bbb Q$, and that it is an Archimedean extension of $G$.
So we can assume that an ordered group is a linearly ordered vector space over the rationals.
My questions are:
What do Archimedean classes of an ordered group look like? Are they isomorphic to subgroups of $Bbb R$ (or the positive parts, to subgroups of $Bbb R^+$)?
If not, what sort of counterexamples can we find?
Gravett proves the Hahn completeness theorem which states that a group $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is isomorphic to its Hahn group (which is $Bbb R^Gamma(G)$ where the exponentiation is similar to ordinal exponentiation). Can we conclude in that case that $G$ is actually an ordered vector space over $Bbb R$?
Can we prove that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is a vector space over $Bbb R$? Does this mean that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $Bbb R$ (or the positive part to the positive reals), or is this a separate fact that we can prove?
group-theory order-theory
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17
 |Â
show 3 more comments
up vote
20
down vote
favorite
up vote
20
down vote
favorite
Recently a post on MathOverflow connected a theorem about ordered abelian groups to the axiom of choice, and it made me want to try and play with these objects a bit.
But it appears to me that I don't know enough about linearly ordered abelian groups. In particular I am interested in the structure of their Archimedean classes. Let's establish some ad-hoc terminology first. Let $(G,+,leq)$ be a linearly ordered abelian group.
- $gin G$ is positive if $g>0$.
- The absolute value of $g$ is $|g|=maxg,-g$.
- If $g,hin G$ then $gsim h$ if and only if $|h|leq|g|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|g|leq n|h|$; or $|g|leq|h|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|h|leq n|g|$.
- An Archimedean class of $G$ is an equivalence class of $sim$. $Gamma(G)$ is the set of equivalence classes, and $preceq$ is the natural ordered induced from $leq$. If $[g],[h]inGamma(G)$ then $[g]preceq[h]$ if and only if $|g|leq|h|$ or $gsim h$.
- If $gin G$ then the positive part of the Archimedean class of $g$ is the set $hin Gmid hsim gland h>0$.
- If $G$ is an ordered group, an Archimedean extension is a group $K$ such that $Gleq K$, and $Gamma(G)=Gamma(K)$. If $G$ has no [nontrivial] Archimedean extensions we say that $G$ is Archimedean complete.
In "Ordered Abelian Groups", Gravett points out that given an ordered group $G$, we can replace it with a "rational group" $G^*$ such that every $xin G^*$ has some $n$ such that $nxin G$ (I believe this is "divisible group" in modern terms, and $G^*$ is the injective hull of $G$). It is quite clear that this rational group is a vector space over $Bbb Q$, and that it is an Archimedean extension of $G$.
So we can assume that an ordered group is a linearly ordered vector space over the rationals.
My questions are:
What do Archimedean classes of an ordered group look like? Are they isomorphic to subgroups of $Bbb R$ (or the positive parts, to subgroups of $Bbb R^+$)?
If not, what sort of counterexamples can we find?
Gravett proves the Hahn completeness theorem which states that a group $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is isomorphic to its Hahn group (which is $Bbb R^Gamma(G)$ where the exponentiation is similar to ordinal exponentiation). Can we conclude in that case that $G$ is actually an ordered vector space over $Bbb R$?
Can we prove that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is a vector space over $Bbb R$? Does this mean that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $Bbb R$ (or the positive part to the positive reals), or is this a separate fact that we can prove?
group-theory order-theory
Recently a post on MathOverflow connected a theorem about ordered abelian groups to the axiom of choice, and it made me want to try and play with these objects a bit.
But it appears to me that I don't know enough about linearly ordered abelian groups. In particular I am interested in the structure of their Archimedean classes. Let's establish some ad-hoc terminology first. Let $(G,+,leq)$ be a linearly ordered abelian group.
- $gin G$ is positive if $g>0$.
- The absolute value of $g$ is $|g|=maxg,-g$.
- If $g,hin G$ then $gsim h$ if and only if $|h|leq|g|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|g|leq n|h|$; or $|g|leq|h|$ and for some natural number $n$, $|h|leq n|g|$.
- An Archimedean class of $G$ is an equivalence class of $sim$. $Gamma(G)$ is the set of equivalence classes, and $preceq$ is the natural ordered induced from $leq$. If $[g],[h]inGamma(G)$ then $[g]preceq[h]$ if and only if $|g|leq|h|$ or $gsim h$.
- If $gin G$ then the positive part of the Archimedean class of $g$ is the set $hin Gmid hsim gland h>0$.
- If $G$ is an ordered group, an Archimedean extension is a group $K$ such that $Gleq K$, and $Gamma(G)=Gamma(K)$. If $G$ has no [nontrivial] Archimedean extensions we say that $G$ is Archimedean complete.
In "Ordered Abelian Groups", Gravett points out that given an ordered group $G$, we can replace it with a "rational group" $G^*$ such that every $xin G^*$ has some $n$ such that $nxin G$ (I believe this is "divisible group" in modern terms, and $G^*$ is the injective hull of $G$). It is quite clear that this rational group is a vector space over $Bbb Q$, and that it is an Archimedean extension of $G$.
So we can assume that an ordered group is a linearly ordered vector space over the rationals.
My questions are:
What do Archimedean classes of an ordered group look like? Are they isomorphic to subgroups of $Bbb R$ (or the positive parts, to subgroups of $Bbb R^+$)?
If not, what sort of counterexamples can we find?
Gravett proves the Hahn completeness theorem which states that a group $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is isomorphic to its Hahn group (which is $Bbb R^Gamma(G)$ where the exponentiation is similar to ordinal exponentiation). Can we conclude in that case that $G$ is actually an ordered vector space over $Bbb R$?
Can we prove that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if it is a vector space over $Bbb R$? Does this mean that $G$ is Archimedean complete if and only if each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $Bbb R$ (or the positive part to the positive reals), or is this a separate fact that we can prove?
group-theory order-theory
edited Apr 13 '17 at 12:58
Communityâ¦
1
1
asked May 21 '13 at 3:45
Asaf Karagilaâ¦
293k31408736
293k31408736
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17
 |Â
show 3 more comments
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17
 |Â
show 3 more comments
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
up vote
0
down vote
These are my answers:
- An Archimedean class is by definition an Archimedean ordered subgroup of $G$, and every Archimedean ordered group is isomorphic to a subgroup of $(mathbbR,+)$.
- no apply.
- Yes. On one side, the Hahn's Embedding theorem states that every abelian ordered group $G$ can be embedded in its Archimedean completion defined by $$mathbbR((Gamma(G))):=ginmathbbR^Gamma(G):qinGamma(G):g(q)neq0mbox is well-ordered.$$ On the other side, $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space (actually it is a field extension of $mathbbR$ when $Gamma(G)$ is an ordered group). Thus, whenever $G$ is Archimedean complete, it is isomorphic to $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$, and thus the scalar multiplication can be defined through isomorphism.
- No and No. A counterexample is
$$G:=gin mathbbR^mathbbQ:qinmathbbQ:g(q)neq0cap(-infty,n]mbox is finite for all ninmathbbZ.$$
Here $G$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space, each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $mathbbR$ and $Gamma(G)=mathbbQ$, but $mathbbR((mathbbQ))$ is a proper Archimedean immediate extension of $G$, actually it is the Archimedean completion of $G$.
add a comment |Â
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
0
down vote
These are my answers:
- An Archimedean class is by definition an Archimedean ordered subgroup of $G$, and every Archimedean ordered group is isomorphic to a subgroup of $(mathbbR,+)$.
- no apply.
- Yes. On one side, the Hahn's Embedding theorem states that every abelian ordered group $G$ can be embedded in its Archimedean completion defined by $$mathbbR((Gamma(G))):=ginmathbbR^Gamma(G):qinGamma(G):g(q)neq0mbox is well-ordered.$$ On the other side, $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space (actually it is a field extension of $mathbbR$ when $Gamma(G)$ is an ordered group). Thus, whenever $G$ is Archimedean complete, it is isomorphic to $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$, and thus the scalar multiplication can be defined through isomorphism.
- No and No. A counterexample is
$$G:=gin mathbbR^mathbbQ:qinmathbbQ:g(q)neq0cap(-infty,n]mbox is finite for all ninmathbbZ.$$
Here $G$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space, each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $mathbbR$ and $Gamma(G)=mathbbQ$, but $mathbbR((mathbbQ))$ is a proper Archimedean immediate extension of $G$, actually it is the Archimedean completion of $G$.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
These are my answers:
- An Archimedean class is by definition an Archimedean ordered subgroup of $G$, and every Archimedean ordered group is isomorphic to a subgroup of $(mathbbR,+)$.
- no apply.
- Yes. On one side, the Hahn's Embedding theorem states that every abelian ordered group $G$ can be embedded in its Archimedean completion defined by $$mathbbR((Gamma(G))):=ginmathbbR^Gamma(G):qinGamma(G):g(q)neq0mbox is well-ordered.$$ On the other side, $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space (actually it is a field extension of $mathbbR$ when $Gamma(G)$ is an ordered group). Thus, whenever $G$ is Archimedean complete, it is isomorphic to $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$, and thus the scalar multiplication can be defined through isomorphism.
- No and No. A counterexample is
$$G:=gin mathbbR^mathbbQ:qinmathbbQ:g(q)neq0cap(-infty,n]mbox is finite for all ninmathbbZ.$$
Here $G$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space, each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $mathbbR$ and $Gamma(G)=mathbbQ$, but $mathbbR((mathbbQ))$ is a proper Archimedean immediate extension of $G$, actually it is the Archimedean completion of $G$.
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
These are my answers:
- An Archimedean class is by definition an Archimedean ordered subgroup of $G$, and every Archimedean ordered group is isomorphic to a subgroup of $(mathbbR,+)$.
- no apply.
- Yes. On one side, the Hahn's Embedding theorem states that every abelian ordered group $G$ can be embedded in its Archimedean completion defined by $$mathbbR((Gamma(G))):=ginmathbbR^Gamma(G):qinGamma(G):g(q)neq0mbox is well-ordered.$$ On the other side, $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space (actually it is a field extension of $mathbbR$ when $Gamma(G)$ is an ordered group). Thus, whenever $G$ is Archimedean complete, it is isomorphic to $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$, and thus the scalar multiplication can be defined through isomorphism.
- No and No. A counterexample is
$$G:=gin mathbbR^mathbbQ:qinmathbbQ:g(q)neq0cap(-infty,n]mbox is finite for all ninmathbbZ.$$
Here $G$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space, each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $mathbbR$ and $Gamma(G)=mathbbQ$, but $mathbbR((mathbbQ))$ is a proper Archimedean immediate extension of $G$, actually it is the Archimedean completion of $G$.
These are my answers:
- An Archimedean class is by definition an Archimedean ordered subgroup of $G$, and every Archimedean ordered group is isomorphic to a subgroup of $(mathbbR,+)$.
- no apply.
- Yes. On one side, the Hahn's Embedding theorem states that every abelian ordered group $G$ can be embedded in its Archimedean completion defined by $$mathbbR((Gamma(G))):=ginmathbbR^Gamma(G):qinGamma(G):g(q)neq0mbox is well-ordered.$$ On the other side, $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space (actually it is a field extension of $mathbbR$ when $Gamma(G)$ is an ordered group). Thus, whenever $G$ is Archimedean complete, it is isomorphic to $mathbbR((Gamma(G)))$, and thus the scalar multiplication can be defined through isomorphism.
- No and No. A counterexample is
$$G:=gin mathbbR^mathbbQ:qinmathbbQ:g(q)neq0cap(-infty,n]mbox is finite for all ninmathbbZ.$$
Here $G$ is a $mathbbR$-vector space, each Archimedean class is isomorphic to $mathbbR$ and $Gamma(G)=mathbbQ$, but $mathbbR((mathbbQ))$ is a proper Archimedean immediate extension of $G$, actually it is the Archimedean completion of $G$.
answered Feb 13 at 3:04
Chilote
1,8641931
1,8641931
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f397817%2fwhat-do-linearly-ordered-abelian-groups-look-like%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
With the term "copy" you mean a "subgroup" or a "isomorphic copy"? In the first case the answer is yes (by Hahn's embedding theorem) and in the second case the answer is no (a trivial counterexample is the rationals).
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 7:09
@boumol: The rational numbers cannot be a vector space over the real numbers. I explicitly pointed out that I am interested in $Gotimes_Bbb ZBbb R$, rather than just $G$ itself. As for the first question, I'm trying to understand the order itself, but I'd be happy to understand the group-theoretic properties of each positive part as well.
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 7:11
Mi mistake for not reading the details. I answered just using the information in the title ("linearly ordered abelian groups").
â boumol
May 21 '13 at 9:59
@boumol: The title was meant to lure you in, and hint you on the contents of the body. It was not meant to ask the actual question!
â Asaf Karagilaâ¦
May 21 '13 at 10:02
What's the ordering on $G otimes_mathbbZ mathbbR$?
â Qiaochu Yuan
May 29 '13 at 4:17