If $ x,y âÂÂBbbZ $ find $x$ and $y$ given: $2x^2-3xy-2y^2=7$
Clash Royale CLAN TAG#URR8PPP
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
We are given an equation:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=7$$
And we have to find $x,y$ where $x,y âÂÂBbbZ$.
After we subtract 7 from both sides, it's clear that this is quadratic equation in its standard form, where $a$ coefficient equals to 2, $b=-3y$ and $c=-2y^2-7$. Thus discriminant equals to $9y^2+16y^2+56=25y^2+56$.
Now $x = frac3yñsqrt25y^2+564$ , $x$ to be an integer $sqrt25y^2+56$ has to be an integer too. I substituted $y$ as nonnegative integer first, because the answer wouldn't differ anyway as it is squared and found that when $y=1$, $sqrt25y^2+56=9$, so we get $x = frac3ñ94$ and when we have plus sign we get $x = frac3+94=3$. So there we have it, $x=3, y=1$ is on of the solution. But $y=-1$ will also work because $y$ is squared, again, we get $x = frac-3ñ94$, if we have minus sign we have $x=-3$. Thus another solution, leaving us with:
$$ x=3, y=1$$
$$ x=-3, y=-1$$
I checked other integers for $y$ but none of them lead to solution where $x$ is also an integer. But here's problem, how do I know for sure that these two solutions are the only solutions, I can't obviously keep substituting $y$ as integers, as there are infinitely many integers. So that's why I came here for help.
diophantine-equations quadratics integers
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
We are given an equation:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=7$$
And we have to find $x,y$ where $x,y âÂÂBbbZ$.
After we subtract 7 from both sides, it's clear that this is quadratic equation in its standard form, where $a$ coefficient equals to 2, $b=-3y$ and $c=-2y^2-7$. Thus discriminant equals to $9y^2+16y^2+56=25y^2+56$.
Now $x = frac3yñsqrt25y^2+564$ , $x$ to be an integer $sqrt25y^2+56$ has to be an integer too. I substituted $y$ as nonnegative integer first, because the answer wouldn't differ anyway as it is squared and found that when $y=1$, $sqrt25y^2+56=9$, so we get $x = frac3ñ94$ and when we have plus sign we get $x = frac3+94=3$. So there we have it, $x=3, y=1$ is on of the solution. But $y=-1$ will also work because $y$ is squared, again, we get $x = frac-3ñ94$, if we have minus sign we have $x=-3$. Thus another solution, leaving us with:
$$ x=3, y=1$$
$$ x=-3, y=-1$$
I checked other integers for $y$ but none of them lead to solution where $x$ is also an integer. But here's problem, how do I know for sure that these two solutions are the only solutions, I can't obviously keep substituting $y$ as integers, as there are infinitely many integers. So that's why I came here for help.
diophantine-equations quadratics integers
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
up vote
3
down vote
favorite
We are given an equation:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=7$$
And we have to find $x,y$ where $x,y âÂÂBbbZ$.
After we subtract 7 from both sides, it's clear that this is quadratic equation in its standard form, where $a$ coefficient equals to 2, $b=-3y$ and $c=-2y^2-7$. Thus discriminant equals to $9y^2+16y^2+56=25y^2+56$.
Now $x = frac3yñsqrt25y^2+564$ , $x$ to be an integer $sqrt25y^2+56$ has to be an integer too. I substituted $y$ as nonnegative integer first, because the answer wouldn't differ anyway as it is squared and found that when $y=1$, $sqrt25y^2+56=9$, so we get $x = frac3ñ94$ and when we have plus sign we get $x = frac3+94=3$. So there we have it, $x=3, y=1$ is on of the solution. But $y=-1$ will also work because $y$ is squared, again, we get $x = frac-3ñ94$, if we have minus sign we have $x=-3$. Thus another solution, leaving us with:
$$ x=3, y=1$$
$$ x=-3, y=-1$$
I checked other integers for $y$ but none of them lead to solution where $x$ is also an integer. But here's problem, how do I know for sure that these two solutions are the only solutions, I can't obviously keep substituting $y$ as integers, as there are infinitely many integers. So that's why I came here for help.
diophantine-equations quadratics integers
We are given an equation:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=7$$
And we have to find $x,y$ where $x,y âÂÂBbbZ$.
After we subtract 7 from both sides, it's clear that this is quadratic equation in its standard form, where $a$ coefficient equals to 2, $b=-3y$ and $c=-2y^2-7$. Thus discriminant equals to $9y^2+16y^2+56=25y^2+56$.
Now $x = frac3yñsqrt25y^2+564$ , $x$ to be an integer $sqrt25y^2+56$ has to be an integer too. I substituted $y$ as nonnegative integer first, because the answer wouldn't differ anyway as it is squared and found that when $y=1$, $sqrt25y^2+56=9$, so we get $x = frac3ñ94$ and when we have plus sign we get $x = frac3+94=3$. So there we have it, $x=3, y=1$ is on of the solution. But $y=-1$ will also work because $y$ is squared, again, we get $x = frac-3ñ94$, if we have minus sign we have $x=-3$. Thus another solution, leaving us with:
$$ x=3, y=1$$
$$ x=-3, y=-1$$
I checked other integers for $y$ but none of them lead to solution where $x$ is also an integer. But here's problem, how do I know for sure that these two solutions are the only solutions, I can't obviously keep substituting $y$ as integers, as there are infinitely many integers. So that's why I came here for help.
diophantine-equations quadratics integers
edited Aug 24 at 10:36
Servaes
1
1
asked Aug 24 at 10:25
Lanet
944
944
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
up vote
3
down vote
accepted
Hint:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=2x^2-4xy+xy-2y^2=2xunderbrace(x-2y)+yunderbrace(x-2y)=?$$
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Hint:
Clearly, if $x,y$ is a solution, $-x,-y$ will also be.
Let $25y^2+56=u^2iff(u-5y)(u+5y)=56$ where $uge0$
As $5y-u,5y+u$ have the same parity, both must be even
$impliesdfracu-5y2cdotdfracu+5y2=14$
Now $14=pm1cdotpm14,pm2cdotpm7$
If $y>0, u+5yge1+5impliesdfracu+5y2ge3$ i.e., $=7$ or $14$
If $y<0, u-5yge1+5$
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Notice $$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=(2x+y)(x-2y)=7.$$
Therefore, we have the four cases:
1) $2x+y=1, x-2y=7.$ Thus $x=dfrac95,y=-dfrac135$, which are not integers.
2) $2x+y=7, x-2y=1.$ Thus $x=3,y=1$, which is a group of proper solution.
3) $2x+y=-1, x-2y=-7.$ $x=-dfrac95,y=dfrac135$, which are not integers.
4)$2x+y=-7, x-2y=-1.$ Thus $x=-3,y=-1$, which is a second group of proper solution.
As a result, we have find two group of integer solution that $$x=3, y=1,$$ or $$x=-3,y=-1.$$
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
Note that $sqrt25y^2+56$ is an integer if and only if $(5y)^2+56=z^2$ for some integer $z$. This limits how big $5y$ can be. After all;
$$29^2=(28+1)^2=28^2+2cdot28+1=28^2+57>28^2+56,$$
so surely $z^2<29^2$ and $(5y)^2<28^2$. This only leaves a few values of $y$ to try.
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
add a comment |Â
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
4 Answers
4
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
3
down vote
accepted
Hint:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=2x^2-4xy+xy-2y^2=2xunderbrace(x-2y)+yunderbrace(x-2y)=?$$
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
accepted
Hint:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=2x^2-4xy+xy-2y^2=2xunderbrace(x-2y)+yunderbrace(x-2y)=?$$
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
accepted
up vote
3
down vote
accepted
Hint:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=2x^2-4xy+xy-2y^2=2xunderbrace(x-2y)+yunderbrace(x-2y)=?$$
Hint:
$$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=2x^2-4xy+xy-2y^2=2xunderbrace(x-2y)+yunderbrace(x-2y)=?$$
answered Aug 24 at 10:44
lab bhattacharjee
216k14153265
216k14153265
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
add a comment |Â
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
1
1
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
Thanks, I get it now.
â Lanet
Aug 24 at 11:10
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Hint:
Clearly, if $x,y$ is a solution, $-x,-y$ will also be.
Let $25y^2+56=u^2iff(u-5y)(u+5y)=56$ where $uge0$
As $5y-u,5y+u$ have the same parity, both must be even
$impliesdfracu-5y2cdotdfracu+5y2=14$
Now $14=pm1cdotpm14,pm2cdotpm7$
If $y>0, u+5yge1+5impliesdfracu+5y2ge3$ i.e., $=7$ or $14$
If $y<0, u-5yge1+5$
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Hint:
Clearly, if $x,y$ is a solution, $-x,-y$ will also be.
Let $25y^2+56=u^2iff(u-5y)(u+5y)=56$ where $uge0$
As $5y-u,5y+u$ have the same parity, both must be even
$impliesdfracu-5y2cdotdfracu+5y2=14$
Now $14=pm1cdotpm14,pm2cdotpm7$
If $y>0, u+5yge1+5impliesdfracu+5y2ge3$ i.e., $=7$ or $14$
If $y<0, u-5yge1+5$
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
Hint:
Clearly, if $x,y$ is a solution, $-x,-y$ will also be.
Let $25y^2+56=u^2iff(u-5y)(u+5y)=56$ where $uge0$
As $5y-u,5y+u$ have the same parity, both must be even
$impliesdfracu-5y2cdotdfracu+5y2=14$
Now $14=pm1cdotpm14,pm2cdotpm7$
If $y>0, u+5yge1+5impliesdfracu+5y2ge3$ i.e., $=7$ or $14$
If $y<0, u-5yge1+5$
Hint:
Clearly, if $x,y$ is a solution, $-x,-y$ will also be.
Let $25y^2+56=u^2iff(u-5y)(u+5y)=56$ where $uge0$
As $5y-u,5y+u$ have the same parity, both must be even
$impliesdfracu-5y2cdotdfracu+5y2=14$
Now $14=pm1cdotpm14,pm2cdotpm7$
If $y>0, u+5yge1+5impliesdfracu+5y2ge3$ i.e., $=7$ or $14$
If $y<0, u-5yge1+5$
edited Aug 24 at 10:40
answered Aug 24 at 10:34
lab bhattacharjee
216k14153265
216k14153265
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Notice $$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=(2x+y)(x-2y)=7.$$
Therefore, we have the four cases:
1) $2x+y=1, x-2y=7.$ Thus $x=dfrac95,y=-dfrac135$, which are not integers.
2) $2x+y=7, x-2y=1.$ Thus $x=3,y=1$, which is a group of proper solution.
3) $2x+y=-1, x-2y=-7.$ $x=-dfrac95,y=dfrac135$, which are not integers.
4)$2x+y=-7, x-2y=-1.$ Thus $x=-3,y=-1$, which is a second group of proper solution.
As a result, we have find two group of integer solution that $$x=3, y=1,$$ or $$x=-3,y=-1.$$
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
Notice $$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=(2x+y)(x-2y)=7.$$
Therefore, we have the four cases:
1) $2x+y=1, x-2y=7.$ Thus $x=dfrac95,y=-dfrac135$, which are not integers.
2) $2x+y=7, x-2y=1.$ Thus $x=3,y=1$, which is a group of proper solution.
3) $2x+y=-1, x-2y=-7.$ $x=-dfrac95,y=dfrac135$, which are not integers.
4)$2x+y=-7, x-2y=-1.$ Thus $x=-3,y=-1$, which is a second group of proper solution.
As a result, we have find two group of integer solution that $$x=3, y=1,$$ or $$x=-3,y=-1.$$
add a comment |Â
up vote
3
down vote
up vote
3
down vote
Notice $$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=(2x+y)(x-2y)=7.$$
Therefore, we have the four cases:
1) $2x+y=1, x-2y=7.$ Thus $x=dfrac95,y=-dfrac135$, which are not integers.
2) $2x+y=7, x-2y=1.$ Thus $x=3,y=1$, which is a group of proper solution.
3) $2x+y=-1, x-2y=-7.$ $x=-dfrac95,y=dfrac135$, which are not integers.
4)$2x+y=-7, x-2y=-1.$ Thus $x=-3,y=-1$, which is a second group of proper solution.
As a result, we have find two group of integer solution that $$x=3, y=1,$$ or $$x=-3,y=-1.$$
Notice $$2x^2-3xy-2y^2=(2x+y)(x-2y)=7.$$
Therefore, we have the four cases:
1) $2x+y=1, x-2y=7.$ Thus $x=dfrac95,y=-dfrac135$, which are not integers.
2) $2x+y=7, x-2y=1.$ Thus $x=3,y=1$, which is a group of proper solution.
3) $2x+y=-1, x-2y=-7.$ $x=-dfrac95,y=dfrac135$, which are not integers.
4)$2x+y=-7, x-2y=-1.$ Thus $x=-3,y=-1$, which is a second group of proper solution.
As a result, we have find two group of integer solution that $$x=3, y=1,$$ or $$x=-3,y=-1.$$
answered Aug 24 at 10:44
mengdie1982
3,565216
3,565216
add a comment |Â
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
Note that $sqrt25y^2+56$ is an integer if and only if $(5y)^2+56=z^2$ for some integer $z$. This limits how big $5y$ can be. After all;
$$29^2=(28+1)^2=28^2+2cdot28+1=28^2+57>28^2+56,$$
so surely $z^2<29^2$ and $(5y)^2<28^2$. This only leaves a few values of $y$ to try.
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
Note that $sqrt25y^2+56$ is an integer if and only if $(5y)^2+56=z^2$ for some integer $z$. This limits how big $5y$ can be. After all;
$$29^2=(28+1)^2=28^2+2cdot28+1=28^2+57>28^2+56,$$
so surely $z^2<29^2$ and $(5y)^2<28^2$. This only leaves a few values of $y$ to try.
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
up vote
2
down vote
Note that $sqrt25y^2+56$ is an integer if and only if $(5y)^2+56=z^2$ for some integer $z$. This limits how big $5y$ can be. After all;
$$29^2=(28+1)^2=28^2+2cdot28+1=28^2+57>28^2+56,$$
so surely $z^2<29^2$ and $(5y)^2<28^2$. This only leaves a few values of $y$ to try.
Note that $sqrt25y^2+56$ is an integer if and only if $(5y)^2+56=z^2$ for some integer $z$. This limits how big $5y$ can be. After all;
$$29^2=(28+1)^2=28^2+2cdot28+1=28^2+57>28^2+56,$$
so surely $z^2<29^2$ and $(5y)^2<28^2$. This only leaves a few values of $y$ to try.
answered Aug 24 at 10:33
Servaes
1
1
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
add a comment |Â
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
I do not get , why $y$ should not be big enough... Could you elaborate please, a bit more?
â dmtri
Aug 24 at 11:19
2
2
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
If $(5y)^2geq28^2$ then $5ygeq28$ so for the next square $(5y+1)^2$ we have $$(5y+1)^2=(5y)^2+2cdot(5y)+1geq(5y)^2+2cdot28+1>(5y)^2+56,$$ so $(5y)^2+56$ cannot be a square.
â Servaes
Aug 24 at 11:40
add a comment |Â
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
StackExchange.ready(
function ()
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2fmath.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f2892975%2fif-x-y-%25e2%2588%2588-bbbz-find-x-and-y-given-2x2-3xy-2y2-7%23new-answer', 'question_page');
);
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function ()
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
);
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password