Prove that there is no bijective homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$

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I need to prove that there does not exist any bijective homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



Here is a way to prove it:



Let $f$ be a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



$Leftrightarrow left(forall left(x, yright) in mathbbQ^2right) fleft(x +yright) = fleft(xright)times fleft(yright)$



$0$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ and $left(forall x in mathbbQright) x^-1=-x$ is the $times-$inverse of $x$



We also know that $1$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



So $$left(forall x in mathbbQright) fleft(x + x^-1right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(x^-1right)$$



$$Leftrightarrow fleft(x + (-x)right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$
$$Leftrightarrow fleft(0right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$



Since $f$ is a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$ then $fleft(0right)=1$



So $$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



Case 1: $f$ is even



Then $$fleft(-xright) = fleft(xright)$$



$Rightarrow f$ is not injective $Rightarrow f$ is not bijective



Case 2: $f$ is odd



Then $$fleft(-xright) = -fleft(xright)$$



So $$f^2left(xright) = -1$$



Since $fleft(xright) in mathbbQ_+^*,$ then $fleft(xright) > 0 Rightarrow f^2left(xright) > 0$



Therefore $f$ is not odd.



Case 3: $f$ is the sum of two functions such that one is even and the other is odd.



so let $f(x) := f_1(x) + f_2(x)$ such that $f_1$ is even and $f_2$ is odd



$$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow left(f_1(x) + f_2(x)right) times left(f_1(x) - f_2(x)right) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) - f_2^2(x) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) = f_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) = sqrtf_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f_1(x) + f_2(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ Rightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ_*^+$$



Therefore the 3th assumption is not correct.



Thus just the first case is correct which implies that $f$ is not bijective.



Is there a shorter proof?







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  • What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
    – Lord Shark the Unknown
    Aug 7 at 19:02






  • 1




    @mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
    – Hamed
    Aug 7 at 19:23






  • 1




    @Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
    – mathcounterexamples.net
    Aug 7 at 19:25














up vote
1
down vote

favorite












I need to prove that there does not exist any bijective homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



Here is a way to prove it:



Let $f$ be a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



$Leftrightarrow left(forall left(x, yright) in mathbbQ^2right) fleft(x +yright) = fleft(xright)times fleft(yright)$



$0$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ and $left(forall x in mathbbQright) x^-1=-x$ is the $times-$inverse of $x$



We also know that $1$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



So $$left(forall x in mathbbQright) fleft(x + x^-1right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(x^-1right)$$



$$Leftrightarrow fleft(x + (-x)right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$
$$Leftrightarrow fleft(0right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$



Since $f$ is a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$ then $fleft(0right)=1$



So $$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



Case 1: $f$ is even



Then $$fleft(-xright) = fleft(xright)$$



$Rightarrow f$ is not injective $Rightarrow f$ is not bijective



Case 2: $f$ is odd



Then $$fleft(-xright) = -fleft(xright)$$



So $$f^2left(xright) = -1$$



Since $fleft(xright) in mathbbQ_+^*,$ then $fleft(xright) > 0 Rightarrow f^2left(xright) > 0$



Therefore $f$ is not odd.



Case 3: $f$ is the sum of two functions such that one is even and the other is odd.



so let $f(x) := f_1(x) + f_2(x)$ such that $f_1$ is even and $f_2$ is odd



$$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow left(f_1(x) + f_2(x)right) times left(f_1(x) - f_2(x)right) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) - f_2^2(x) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) = f_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) = sqrtf_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f_1(x) + f_2(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ Rightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ_*^+$$



Therefore the 3th assumption is not correct.



Thus just the first case is correct which implies that $f$ is not bijective.



Is there a shorter proof?







share|cite|improve this question



















  • What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
    – Lord Shark the Unknown
    Aug 7 at 19:02






  • 1




    @mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
    – Hamed
    Aug 7 at 19:23






  • 1




    @Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
    – mathcounterexamples.net
    Aug 7 at 19:25












up vote
1
down vote

favorite









up vote
1
down vote

favorite











I need to prove that there does not exist any bijective homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



Here is a way to prove it:



Let $f$ be a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



$Leftrightarrow left(forall left(x, yright) in mathbbQ^2right) fleft(x +yright) = fleft(xright)times fleft(yright)$



$0$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ and $left(forall x in mathbbQright) x^-1=-x$ is the $times-$inverse of $x$



We also know that $1$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



So $$left(forall x in mathbbQright) fleft(x + x^-1right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(x^-1right)$$



$$Leftrightarrow fleft(x + (-x)right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$
$$Leftrightarrow fleft(0right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$



Since $f$ is a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$ then $fleft(0right)=1$



So $$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



Case 1: $f$ is even



Then $$fleft(-xright) = fleft(xright)$$



$Rightarrow f$ is not injective $Rightarrow f$ is not bijective



Case 2: $f$ is odd



Then $$fleft(-xright) = -fleft(xright)$$



So $$f^2left(xright) = -1$$



Since $fleft(xright) in mathbbQ_+^*,$ then $fleft(xright) > 0 Rightarrow f^2left(xright) > 0$



Therefore $f$ is not odd.



Case 3: $f$ is the sum of two functions such that one is even and the other is odd.



so let $f(x) := f_1(x) + f_2(x)$ such that $f_1$ is even and $f_2$ is odd



$$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow left(f_1(x) + f_2(x)right) times left(f_1(x) - f_2(x)right) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) - f_2^2(x) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) = f_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) = sqrtf_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f_1(x) + f_2(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ Rightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ_*^+$$



Therefore the 3th assumption is not correct.



Thus just the first case is correct which implies that $f$ is not bijective.



Is there a shorter proof?







share|cite|improve this question











I need to prove that there does not exist any bijective homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



Here is a way to prove it:



Let $f$ be a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



$Leftrightarrow left(forall left(x, yright) in mathbbQ^2right) fleft(x +yright) = fleft(xright)times fleft(yright)$



$0$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ and $left(forall x in mathbbQright) x^-1=-x$ is the $times-$inverse of $x$



We also know that $1$ is the identity element of $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$



So $$left(forall x in mathbbQright) fleft(x + x^-1right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(x^-1right)$$



$$Leftrightarrow fleft(x + (-x)right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$
$$Leftrightarrow fleft(0right) = fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright)$$



Since $f$ is a homomorphism from $left(mathbbQ, +right)$ to $left(mathbbQ_+^*, times right)$ then $fleft(0right)=1$



So $$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



Case 1: $f$ is even



Then $$fleft(-xright) = fleft(xright)$$



$Rightarrow f$ is not injective $Rightarrow f$ is not bijective



Case 2: $f$ is odd



Then $$fleft(-xright) = -fleft(xright)$$



So $$f^2left(xright) = -1$$



Since $fleft(xright) in mathbbQ_+^*,$ then $fleft(xright) > 0 Rightarrow f^2left(xright) > 0$



Therefore $f$ is not odd.



Case 3: $f$ is the sum of two functions such that one is even and the other is odd.



so let $f(x) := f_1(x) + f_2(x)$ such that $f_1$ is even and $f_2$ is odd



$$fleft(xright)times fleft(-xright) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow left(f_1(x) + f_2(x)right) times left(f_1(x) - f_2(x)right) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) - f_2^2(x) = 1$$



$$Leftrightarrow f_1^2(x) = f_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) = sqrtf_2^2(x) + 1$$



$$Rightarrow f_1(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f_1(x) + f_2(x) notin mathbbQ Leftrightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ Rightarrow f(x) notin mathbbQ_*^+$$



Therefore the 3th assumption is not correct.



Thus just the first case is correct which implies that $f$ is not bijective.



Is there a shorter proof?









share|cite|improve this question










share|cite|improve this question




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asked Aug 7 at 18:56









Ayoub Falah

302113




302113











  • What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
    – Lord Shark the Unknown
    Aug 7 at 19:02






  • 1




    @mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
    – Hamed
    Aug 7 at 19:23






  • 1




    @Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
    – mathcounterexamples.net
    Aug 7 at 19:25
















  • What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
    – Lord Shark the Unknown
    Aug 7 at 19:02






  • 1




    @mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
    – Hamed
    Aug 7 at 19:23






  • 1




    @Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
    – mathcounterexamples.net
    Aug 7 at 19:25















What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
– Lord Shark the Unknown
Aug 7 at 19:02




What in $Bbb Q$ could correspond with $2inBbb Q_+^*$?
– Lord Shark the Unknown
Aug 7 at 19:02




1




1




@mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
– Hamed
Aug 7 at 19:23




@mathcounterexamples.net yup, mistakes were made. I do not know what exactly happened in my brain at that moment. I realized what I had said, the moment I read my own comment.
– Hamed
Aug 7 at 19:23




1




1




@Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
– mathcounterexamples.net
Aug 7 at 19:25




@Hamed My own comment is now deleted. We are just humans!
– mathcounterexamples.net
Aug 7 at 19:25










1 Answer
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There is a shorter way. By assumption there is an $a in mathbbQ$ with $f(a) = 2$. Then
$$
2=f(a) = fleft(fraca2 +fraca2right) = fleft(fraca2right)^2.
$$
But $f(a/2)$ must be rational and $sqrt2$ is not.






share|cite|improve this answer

















  • 1




    Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
    – Lubin
    Aug 7 at 20:17










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active

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up vote
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There is a shorter way. By assumption there is an $a in mathbbQ$ with $f(a) = 2$. Then
$$
2=f(a) = fleft(fraca2 +fraca2right) = fleft(fraca2right)^2.
$$
But $f(a/2)$ must be rational and $sqrt2$ is not.






share|cite|improve this answer

















  • 1




    Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
    – Lubin
    Aug 7 at 20:17














up vote
5
down vote













There is a shorter way. By assumption there is an $a in mathbbQ$ with $f(a) = 2$. Then
$$
2=f(a) = fleft(fraca2 +fraca2right) = fleft(fraca2right)^2.
$$
But $f(a/2)$ must be rational and $sqrt2$ is not.






share|cite|improve this answer

















  • 1




    Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
    – Lubin
    Aug 7 at 20:17












up vote
5
down vote










up vote
5
down vote









There is a shorter way. By assumption there is an $a in mathbbQ$ with $f(a) = 2$. Then
$$
2=f(a) = fleft(fraca2 +fraca2right) = fleft(fraca2right)^2.
$$
But $f(a/2)$ must be rational and $sqrt2$ is not.






share|cite|improve this answer













There is a shorter way. By assumption there is an $a in mathbbQ$ with $f(a) = 2$. Then
$$
2=f(a) = fleft(fraca2 +fraca2right) = fleft(fraca2right)^2.
$$
But $f(a/2)$ must be rational and $sqrt2$ is not.







share|cite|improve this answer













share|cite|improve this answer



share|cite|improve this answer











answered Aug 7 at 19:08









Randall

7,2471825




7,2471825







  • 1




    Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
    – Lubin
    Aug 7 at 20:17












  • 1




    Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
    – Lubin
    Aug 7 at 20:17







1




1




Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
– Lubin
Aug 7 at 20:17




Perfect. More abstractly, the additive group is divisible, and the multiplicative group is not.
– Lubin
Aug 7 at 20:17












 

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