Finding required integers that satisfy an inequality

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Let $R$ denote a non-negative rational number. Determine a fixed set of integers $a,b,c,d,e,f$, such that for every choice of $R$,



$left|fracaR^2+bR+cdR^2+eR+f-sqrt[3]2right|<|R-sqrt[3]2|$



The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$. And then I tried solving the equation I get however I am unable to solve for integers. Any help please







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  • I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 8:03










  • @saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
    – saisanjeev
    Aug 22 at 12:11










  • You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 16:06














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Let $R$ denote a non-negative rational number. Determine a fixed set of integers $a,b,c,d,e,f$, such that for every choice of $R$,



$left|fracaR^2+bR+cdR^2+eR+f-sqrt[3]2right|<|R-sqrt[3]2|$



The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$. And then I tried solving the equation I get however I am unable to solve for integers. Any help please







share|cite|improve this question




















  • I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 8:03










  • @saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
    – saisanjeev
    Aug 22 at 12:11










  • You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 16:06












up vote
0
down vote

favorite









up vote
0
down vote

favorite











Let $R$ denote a non-negative rational number. Determine a fixed set of integers $a,b,c,d,e,f$, such that for every choice of $R$,



$left|fracaR^2+bR+cdR^2+eR+f-sqrt[3]2right|<|R-sqrt[3]2|$



The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$. And then I tried solving the equation I get however I am unable to solve for integers. Any help please







share|cite|improve this question












Let $R$ denote a non-negative rational number. Determine a fixed set of integers $a,b,c,d,e,f$, such that for every choice of $R$,



$left|fracaR^2+bR+cdR^2+eR+f-sqrt[3]2right|<|R-sqrt[3]2|$



The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$. And then I tried solving the equation I get however I am unable to solve for integers. Any help please









share|cite|improve this question











share|cite|improve this question




share|cite|improve this question










asked Aug 22 at 7:57









saisanjeev

418210




418210











  • I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 8:03










  • @saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
    – saisanjeev
    Aug 22 at 12:11










  • You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 16:06
















  • I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 8:03










  • @saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
    – saisanjeev
    Aug 22 at 12:11










  • You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
    – saulspatz
    Aug 22 at 16:06















I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
– saulspatz
Aug 22 at 8:03




I don't understand the description of your computation. Could you post the details, please?
– saulspatz
Aug 22 at 8:03












@saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
– saisanjeev
Aug 22 at 12:11




@saulspatz I am not confident about my computation. However as R tends to cube root of 2, the RHS of the inequality tends to zero, hence as I apply the same limit on the LHS it should tend to zero as well.
– saisanjeev
Aug 22 at 12:11












You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
– saulspatz
Aug 22 at 16:06




You say you got an equation you couldn't solve. You should show the equation and the work that led up to it. Perhaps someone can solve the equation; perhaps someone can point out a mistake in the derivation. That way, you can get some actual help. As it is, the only thing anyone can do is solve the problem from scratch, which won't help you near as much.
– saulspatz
Aug 22 at 16:06










1 Answer
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(Too long for a comment.) The question is missing a lot of context, so it is hard to guess if the following even applies at all. But FWIW the given form reminisces of an iterated approximation steadily approaching $,sqrt[3]2,$.



Newton-Raphson would come to mind first, but the canonical $,f(x) = x^3-2,$ doesn't give $,x - f(x) / f'(x),$ in the prescribed form of a ratio of two quadratics.



Another way to "guess" an answer could be to start from the identity $,a^3-b^3=(a-b)(a^2+ab+b^2),$, so $,sqrt[3]2=1+1 big/ left(left(sqrt[3]2right)^2+sqrt[3]2+1right),$ i.e. $,sqrt[3]2$ is a fixed point of $,f(x)=(x^2+x+2)/(x^2+x+1),$ which corresponds to $,a=b=d=e=f=1, c=2,$ and does indeed appear to converge as required. Formally proving that convergence would take some more work, though.






[ EDIT ]   Following up on OP's insight that...


The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$.




Formalizing the above, let $,f(x)=dfracax^2+bx+cdx^2+ex+f,$ and consider the sequence defined by $,r_n+1=f(r_n),$ for some $,r_0 in mathbbR,$. Furthermore, suppose that $,r_n to r = sqrt[3]2,$, then passing the recurrence relation to the limit gives:



$$r=f(r) ;;iff;; dr^3+(e-a)r^2+(f-b)r-c = 0$$



But the minimal polynomial of $,r=sqrt[3]2,$ over $,Bbb Z[X],$ is $x^3 - 2$, so it follows that $,beginalignbegincases2d &= c \ e&=a \f&=bendcasesendalign,$ and therefore $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2ddx^2+ax+b,$ or, choosing WLOG $,d=1,$, $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2x^2+ax+b,$ .



The case given in the original answer $,f(x)=dfracx^2+x+2x^2+x+1,$ corresponds to $,a=b=1,$ above.






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    1 Answer
    1






    active

    oldest

    votes








    1 Answer
    1






    active

    oldest

    votes









    active

    oldest

    votes






    active

    oldest

    votes








    up vote
    1
    down vote



    accepted










    (Too long for a comment.) The question is missing a lot of context, so it is hard to guess if the following even applies at all. But FWIW the given form reminisces of an iterated approximation steadily approaching $,sqrt[3]2,$.



    Newton-Raphson would come to mind first, but the canonical $,f(x) = x^3-2,$ doesn't give $,x - f(x) / f'(x),$ in the prescribed form of a ratio of two quadratics.



    Another way to "guess" an answer could be to start from the identity $,a^3-b^3=(a-b)(a^2+ab+b^2),$, so $,sqrt[3]2=1+1 big/ left(left(sqrt[3]2right)^2+sqrt[3]2+1right),$ i.e. $,sqrt[3]2$ is a fixed point of $,f(x)=(x^2+x+2)/(x^2+x+1),$ which corresponds to $,a=b=d=e=f=1, c=2,$ and does indeed appear to converge as required. Formally proving that convergence would take some more work, though.






    [ EDIT ]   Following up on OP's insight that...


    The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$.




    Formalizing the above, let $,f(x)=dfracax^2+bx+cdx^2+ex+f,$ and consider the sequence defined by $,r_n+1=f(r_n),$ for some $,r_0 in mathbbR,$. Furthermore, suppose that $,r_n to r = sqrt[3]2,$, then passing the recurrence relation to the limit gives:



    $$r=f(r) ;;iff;; dr^3+(e-a)r^2+(f-b)r-c = 0$$



    But the minimal polynomial of $,r=sqrt[3]2,$ over $,Bbb Z[X],$ is $x^3 - 2$, so it follows that $,beginalignbegincases2d &= c \ e&=a \f&=bendcasesendalign,$ and therefore $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2ddx^2+ax+b,$ or, choosing WLOG $,d=1,$, $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2x^2+ax+b,$ .



    The case given in the original answer $,f(x)=dfracx^2+x+2x^2+x+1,$ corresponds to $,a=b=1,$ above.






    share|cite|improve this answer


























      up vote
      1
      down vote



      accepted










      (Too long for a comment.) The question is missing a lot of context, so it is hard to guess if the following even applies at all. But FWIW the given form reminisces of an iterated approximation steadily approaching $,sqrt[3]2,$.



      Newton-Raphson would come to mind first, but the canonical $,f(x) = x^3-2,$ doesn't give $,x - f(x) / f'(x),$ in the prescribed form of a ratio of two quadratics.



      Another way to "guess" an answer could be to start from the identity $,a^3-b^3=(a-b)(a^2+ab+b^2),$, so $,sqrt[3]2=1+1 big/ left(left(sqrt[3]2right)^2+sqrt[3]2+1right),$ i.e. $,sqrt[3]2$ is a fixed point of $,f(x)=(x^2+x+2)/(x^2+x+1),$ which corresponds to $,a=b=d=e=f=1, c=2,$ and does indeed appear to converge as required. Formally proving that convergence would take some more work, though.






      [ EDIT ]   Following up on OP's insight that...


      The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$.




      Formalizing the above, let $,f(x)=dfracax^2+bx+cdx^2+ex+f,$ and consider the sequence defined by $,r_n+1=f(r_n),$ for some $,r_0 in mathbbR,$. Furthermore, suppose that $,r_n to r = sqrt[3]2,$, then passing the recurrence relation to the limit gives:



      $$r=f(r) ;;iff;; dr^3+(e-a)r^2+(f-b)r-c = 0$$



      But the minimal polynomial of $,r=sqrt[3]2,$ over $,Bbb Z[X],$ is $x^3 - 2$, so it follows that $,beginalignbegincases2d &= c \ e&=a \f&=bendcasesendalign,$ and therefore $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2ddx^2+ax+b,$ or, choosing WLOG $,d=1,$, $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2x^2+ax+b,$ .



      The case given in the original answer $,f(x)=dfracx^2+x+2x^2+x+1,$ corresponds to $,a=b=1,$ above.






      share|cite|improve this answer
























        up vote
        1
        down vote



        accepted







        up vote
        1
        down vote



        accepted






        (Too long for a comment.) The question is missing a lot of context, so it is hard to guess if the following even applies at all. But FWIW the given form reminisces of an iterated approximation steadily approaching $,sqrt[3]2,$.



        Newton-Raphson would come to mind first, but the canonical $,f(x) = x^3-2,$ doesn't give $,x - f(x) / f'(x),$ in the prescribed form of a ratio of two quadratics.



        Another way to "guess" an answer could be to start from the identity $,a^3-b^3=(a-b)(a^2+ab+b^2),$, so $,sqrt[3]2=1+1 big/ left(left(sqrt[3]2right)^2+sqrt[3]2+1right),$ i.e. $,sqrt[3]2$ is a fixed point of $,f(x)=(x^2+x+2)/(x^2+x+1),$ which corresponds to $,a=b=d=e=f=1, c=2,$ and does indeed appear to converge as required. Formally proving that convergence would take some more work, though.






        [ EDIT ]   Following up on OP's insight that...


        The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$.




        Formalizing the above, let $,f(x)=dfracax^2+bx+cdx^2+ex+f,$ and consider the sequence defined by $,r_n+1=f(r_n),$ for some $,r_0 in mathbbR,$. Furthermore, suppose that $,r_n to r = sqrt[3]2,$, then passing the recurrence relation to the limit gives:



        $$r=f(r) ;;iff;; dr^3+(e-a)r^2+(f-b)r-c = 0$$



        But the minimal polynomial of $,r=sqrt[3]2,$ over $,Bbb Z[X],$ is $x^3 - 2$, so it follows that $,beginalignbegincases2d &= c \ e&=a \f&=bendcasesendalign,$ and therefore $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2ddx^2+ax+b,$ or, choosing WLOG $,d=1,$, $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2x^2+ax+b,$ .



        The case given in the original answer $,f(x)=dfracx^2+x+2x^2+x+1,$ corresponds to $,a=b=1,$ above.






        share|cite|improve this answer














        (Too long for a comment.) The question is missing a lot of context, so it is hard to guess if the following even applies at all. But FWIW the given form reminisces of an iterated approximation steadily approaching $,sqrt[3]2,$.



        Newton-Raphson would come to mind first, but the canonical $,f(x) = x^3-2,$ doesn't give $,x - f(x) / f'(x),$ in the prescribed form of a ratio of two quadratics.



        Another way to "guess" an answer could be to start from the identity $,a^3-b^3=(a-b)(a^2+ab+b^2),$, so $,sqrt[3]2=1+1 big/ left(left(sqrt[3]2right)^2+sqrt[3]2+1right),$ i.e. $,sqrt[3]2$ is a fixed point of $,f(x)=(x^2+x+2)/(x^2+x+1),$ which corresponds to $,a=b=d=e=f=1, c=2,$ and does indeed appear to converge as required. Formally proving that convergence would take some more work, though.






        [ EDIT ]   Following up on OP's insight that...


        The given inequality seemed too much similar to limits so I applied R tending to $sqrt[3]2$.




        Formalizing the above, let $,f(x)=dfracax^2+bx+cdx^2+ex+f,$ and consider the sequence defined by $,r_n+1=f(r_n),$ for some $,r_0 in mathbbR,$. Furthermore, suppose that $,r_n to r = sqrt[3]2,$, then passing the recurrence relation to the limit gives:



        $$r=f(r) ;;iff;; dr^3+(e-a)r^2+(f-b)r-c = 0$$



        But the minimal polynomial of $,r=sqrt[3]2,$ over $,Bbb Z[X],$ is $x^3 - 2$, so it follows that $,beginalignbegincases2d &= c \ e&=a \f&=bendcasesendalign,$ and therefore $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2ddx^2+ax+b,$ or, choosing WLOG $,d=1,$, $,f(x) = dfracax^2+bx+2x^2+ax+b,$ .



        The case given in the original answer $,f(x)=dfracx^2+x+2x^2+x+1,$ corresponds to $,a=b=1,$ above.







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        edited Aug 24 at 21:50

























        answered Aug 23 at 5:43









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