Valuation ring of $K(alpha)$ is $A[alpha]$?
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Let $A$ be a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, let $l$ be a finite separable extension of $k$, then $l=k(baralpha)$ for some $baralphain l$ whose minimal polynomial $bar gin k[x]$ is monic, irreducible and separable. Let $gin A[x]$ be any lift of $bar g$ that is monic, then $g$ is also irreducible and separable.
Define $L:= K[x]/(g(x))=K(alpha)$, where $alpha$ is the image of $x$ in $K[x]/(g(x))$, then $L$ has valuation ring $B$ which equals to $A[alpha]$.
Why is $B$, the valuation ring of $L = K(alpha)$, equal to $A[alpha]$?
I know since $A$ is a complete DVR, $B$ is the integral closure of $A$ is $L$, so $A[alpha]subset B$, but I don't know the other inclusion.
p.s. It is found in one step in the proof in a course manual, that if $A$ is a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, then there's a correspondence between unramified extensions $L/K$ and separable extensions $l,/,k$.
number-theory algebraic-number-theory valuation-theory
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Let $A$ be a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, let $l$ be a finite separable extension of $k$, then $l=k(baralpha)$ for some $baralphain l$ whose minimal polynomial $bar gin k[x]$ is monic, irreducible and separable. Let $gin A[x]$ be any lift of $bar g$ that is monic, then $g$ is also irreducible and separable.
Define $L:= K[x]/(g(x))=K(alpha)$, where $alpha$ is the image of $x$ in $K[x]/(g(x))$, then $L$ has valuation ring $B$ which equals to $A[alpha]$.
Why is $B$, the valuation ring of $L = K(alpha)$, equal to $A[alpha]$?
I know since $A$ is a complete DVR, $B$ is the integral closure of $A$ is $L$, so $A[alpha]subset B$, but I don't know the other inclusion.
p.s. It is found in one step in the proof in a course manual, that if $A$ is a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, then there's a correspondence between unramified extensions $L/K$ and separable extensions $l,/,k$.
number-theory algebraic-number-theory valuation-theory
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
Let $A$ be a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, let $l$ be a finite separable extension of $k$, then $l=k(baralpha)$ for some $baralphain l$ whose minimal polynomial $bar gin k[x]$ is monic, irreducible and separable. Let $gin A[x]$ be any lift of $bar g$ that is monic, then $g$ is also irreducible and separable.
Define $L:= K[x]/(g(x))=K(alpha)$, where $alpha$ is the image of $x$ in $K[x]/(g(x))$, then $L$ has valuation ring $B$ which equals to $A[alpha]$.
Why is $B$, the valuation ring of $L = K(alpha)$, equal to $A[alpha]$?
I know since $A$ is a complete DVR, $B$ is the integral closure of $A$ is $L$, so $A[alpha]subset B$, but I don't know the other inclusion.
p.s. It is found in one step in the proof in a course manual, that if $A$ is a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, then there's a correspondence between unramified extensions $L/K$ and separable extensions $l,/,k$.
number-theory algebraic-number-theory valuation-theory
Let $A$ be a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, let $l$ be a finite separable extension of $k$, then $l=k(baralpha)$ for some $baralphain l$ whose minimal polynomial $bar gin k[x]$ is monic, irreducible and separable. Let $gin A[x]$ be any lift of $bar g$ that is monic, then $g$ is also irreducible and separable.
Define $L:= K[x]/(g(x))=K(alpha)$, where $alpha$ is the image of $x$ in $K[x]/(g(x))$, then $L$ has valuation ring $B$ which equals to $A[alpha]$.
Why is $B$, the valuation ring of $L = K(alpha)$, equal to $A[alpha]$?
I know since $A$ is a complete DVR, $B$ is the integral closure of $A$ is $L$, so $A[alpha]subset B$, but I don't know the other inclusion.
p.s. It is found in one step in the proof in a course manual, that if $A$ is a complete DVR with fraction field $K$ and residue field $k$, then there's a correspondence between unramified extensions $L/K$ and separable extensions $l,/,k$.
number-theory algebraic-number-theory valuation-theory
number-theory algebraic-number-theory valuation-theory
edited Sep 6 at 1:56
asked Sep 4 at 11:11
CYC
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2 Answers
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accepted
The reason is quite simple.
First we show $l$ is indeed the residual field $B/mathfrakP$, temporarily let $l'$ denote the residual field. Then $[l':k]leq [L:K]$. Also $$alpha in Limplies baralpha in l' implies l=k(baralpha) subset l'$$
Hence $[l':l]geq 1$. If $[l':l]>1$, then $[l:k] leq [L:K]/[l':l] < [L:K]$, contradicting to $[L:K]=[l:k]$. Therefore $l=l'$.
Let $n=[L:K]=[l:k]$, $mathfrakP$ be the prime ideal in $L$ and $v$ the valuation on $K$. Suppose $$k_0 + k_1 alpha + cdots + k_n-1 alpha^n-1 in B qquad k_iin K$$
If there is some $k_i$ such that $v(k_i)<0$, let this $i$ be such that $v(k_i)$ is minimal. Dividing both sides by $k_i$ gives
$$a_0 + a_1 alpha + cdots + a_n-1 alpha^n-1 in mathfrakP qquad v(a_j)geq 0,a_i=1$$
this says $1,baralpha,cdots,baralpha^n-1$ are linearly dependent over $k$, a contradiction.
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
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Thanks for @pisco that done most of the work for me, though due to subtle detail of notations(like different definitions of $baralpha$), I will accept his and write my commentary here.
Let $hatalpha$ be the image of $alpha$ in $B/mathfrak P$, then by construction of $g$, $bar g(hatalpha) = 0$, since $bar g$ is irreducible by assumption, $hatalphaneq 0$ in $B/mathfrak P$, so $alphanotin mathfrak P$ hence $B=A[alpha]$.
p.s. We have $n=[k(hatalpha):k] leq [B/mathfrak P : k]leq [L:K] = n$, so $B/mathfrak P =k(hatalpha) approx k(baralpha) = l.$
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
The reason is quite simple.
First we show $l$ is indeed the residual field $B/mathfrakP$, temporarily let $l'$ denote the residual field. Then $[l':k]leq [L:K]$. Also $$alpha in Limplies baralpha in l' implies l=k(baralpha) subset l'$$
Hence $[l':l]geq 1$. If $[l':l]>1$, then $[l:k] leq [L:K]/[l':l] < [L:K]$, contradicting to $[L:K]=[l:k]$. Therefore $l=l'$.
Let $n=[L:K]=[l:k]$, $mathfrakP$ be the prime ideal in $L$ and $v$ the valuation on $K$. Suppose $$k_0 + k_1 alpha + cdots + k_n-1 alpha^n-1 in B qquad k_iin K$$
If there is some $k_i$ such that $v(k_i)<0$, let this $i$ be such that $v(k_i)$ is minimal. Dividing both sides by $k_i$ gives
$$a_0 + a_1 alpha + cdots + a_n-1 alpha^n-1 in mathfrakP qquad v(a_j)geq 0,a_i=1$$
this says $1,baralpha,cdots,baralpha^n-1$ are linearly dependent over $k$, a contradiction.
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
The reason is quite simple.
First we show $l$ is indeed the residual field $B/mathfrakP$, temporarily let $l'$ denote the residual field. Then $[l':k]leq [L:K]$. Also $$alpha in Limplies baralpha in l' implies l=k(baralpha) subset l'$$
Hence $[l':l]geq 1$. If $[l':l]>1$, then $[l:k] leq [L:K]/[l':l] < [L:K]$, contradicting to $[L:K]=[l:k]$. Therefore $l=l'$.
Let $n=[L:K]=[l:k]$, $mathfrakP$ be the prime ideal in $L$ and $v$ the valuation on $K$. Suppose $$k_0 + k_1 alpha + cdots + k_n-1 alpha^n-1 in B qquad k_iin K$$
If there is some $k_i$ such that $v(k_i)<0$, let this $i$ be such that $v(k_i)$ is minimal. Dividing both sides by $k_i$ gives
$$a_0 + a_1 alpha + cdots + a_n-1 alpha^n-1 in mathfrakP qquad v(a_j)geq 0,a_i=1$$
this says $1,baralpha,cdots,baralpha^n-1$ are linearly dependent over $k$, a contradiction.
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
up vote
2
down vote
accepted
The reason is quite simple.
First we show $l$ is indeed the residual field $B/mathfrakP$, temporarily let $l'$ denote the residual field. Then $[l':k]leq [L:K]$. Also $$alpha in Limplies baralpha in l' implies l=k(baralpha) subset l'$$
Hence $[l':l]geq 1$. If $[l':l]>1$, then $[l:k] leq [L:K]/[l':l] < [L:K]$, contradicting to $[L:K]=[l:k]$. Therefore $l=l'$.
Let $n=[L:K]=[l:k]$, $mathfrakP$ be the prime ideal in $L$ and $v$ the valuation on $K$. Suppose $$k_0 + k_1 alpha + cdots + k_n-1 alpha^n-1 in B qquad k_iin K$$
If there is some $k_i$ such that $v(k_i)<0$, let this $i$ be such that $v(k_i)$ is minimal. Dividing both sides by $k_i$ gives
$$a_0 + a_1 alpha + cdots + a_n-1 alpha^n-1 in mathfrakP qquad v(a_j)geq 0,a_i=1$$
this says $1,baralpha,cdots,baralpha^n-1$ are linearly dependent over $k$, a contradiction.
The reason is quite simple.
First we show $l$ is indeed the residual field $B/mathfrakP$, temporarily let $l'$ denote the residual field. Then $[l':k]leq [L:K]$. Also $$alpha in Limplies baralpha in l' implies l=k(baralpha) subset l'$$
Hence $[l':l]geq 1$. If $[l':l]>1$, then $[l:k] leq [L:K]/[l':l] < [L:K]$, contradicting to $[L:K]=[l:k]$. Therefore $l=l'$.
Let $n=[L:K]=[l:k]$, $mathfrakP$ be the prime ideal in $L$ and $v$ the valuation on $K$. Suppose $$k_0 + k_1 alpha + cdots + k_n-1 alpha^n-1 in B qquad k_iin K$$
If there is some $k_i$ such that $v(k_i)<0$, let this $i$ be such that $v(k_i)$ is minimal. Dividing both sides by $k_i$ gives
$$a_0 + a_1 alpha + cdots + a_n-1 alpha^n-1 in mathfrakP qquad v(a_j)geq 0,a_i=1$$
this says $1,baralpha,cdots,baralpha^n-1$ are linearly dependent over $k$, a contradiction.
edited Sep 6 at 4:04
answered Sep 4 at 17:23
pisco
10.1k21336
10.1k21336
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
 |Â
show 1 more comment
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
It needs $v(alpha)=0$ right?($v$ extends from $K$ to $L$) Why is it the case?
â CYC
Sep 5 at 8:21
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
@CYC If $v(alpha) > 0$, then $alpha in mathfrakP implies baralpha = 0$ in $l$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 8:52
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
But $l$ is a given field and $L$ is what we constructed from it, at given point we don't know $l$ isomorphic to $B/mathfrak B$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:07
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I suppose you meant $mathfrakP$ rather than $mathfrakB$. $l = B/mathfrakP$ is true because $mathfrakP$ is defined as the prime ideal of $B$.
â pisco
Sep 5 at 9:16
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
I mean $L$ is newly constructed from a given $l$, then $B$ is defined from $L$, at bare construction we don't know yet $l$ is its residue field(though in fact they will be isomorphic.), and I think in fact we need $B=A[alpha]$ first in order to prove $l$ is the residue field of $L$.
â CYC
Sep 5 at 9:22
 |Â
show 1 more comment
up vote
0
down vote
Thanks for @pisco that done most of the work for me, though due to subtle detail of notations(like different definitions of $baralpha$), I will accept his and write my commentary here.
Let $hatalpha$ be the image of $alpha$ in $B/mathfrak P$, then by construction of $g$, $bar g(hatalpha) = 0$, since $bar g$ is irreducible by assumption, $hatalphaneq 0$ in $B/mathfrak P$, so $alphanotin mathfrak P$ hence $B=A[alpha]$.
p.s. We have $n=[k(hatalpha):k] leq [B/mathfrak P : k]leq [L:K] = n$, so $B/mathfrak P =k(hatalpha) approx k(baralpha) = l.$
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
Thanks for @pisco that done most of the work for me, though due to subtle detail of notations(like different definitions of $baralpha$), I will accept his and write my commentary here.
Let $hatalpha$ be the image of $alpha$ in $B/mathfrak P$, then by construction of $g$, $bar g(hatalpha) = 0$, since $bar g$ is irreducible by assumption, $hatalphaneq 0$ in $B/mathfrak P$, so $alphanotin mathfrak P$ hence $B=A[alpha]$.
p.s. We have $n=[k(hatalpha):k] leq [B/mathfrak P : k]leq [L:K] = n$, so $B/mathfrak P =k(hatalpha) approx k(baralpha) = l.$
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
add a comment |Â
up vote
0
down vote
up vote
0
down vote
Thanks for @pisco that done most of the work for me, though due to subtle detail of notations(like different definitions of $baralpha$), I will accept his and write my commentary here.
Let $hatalpha$ be the image of $alpha$ in $B/mathfrak P$, then by construction of $g$, $bar g(hatalpha) = 0$, since $bar g$ is irreducible by assumption, $hatalphaneq 0$ in $B/mathfrak P$, so $alphanotin mathfrak P$ hence $B=A[alpha]$.
p.s. We have $n=[k(hatalpha):k] leq [B/mathfrak P : k]leq [L:K] = n$, so $B/mathfrak P =k(hatalpha) approx k(baralpha) = l.$
Thanks for @pisco that done most of the work for me, though due to subtle detail of notations(like different definitions of $baralpha$), I will accept his and write my commentary here.
Let $hatalpha$ be the image of $alpha$ in $B/mathfrak P$, then by construction of $g$, $bar g(hatalpha) = 0$, since $bar g$ is irreducible by assumption, $hatalphaneq 0$ in $B/mathfrak P$, so $alphanotin mathfrak P$ hence $B=A[alpha]$.
p.s. We have $n=[k(hatalpha):k] leq [B/mathfrak P : k]leq [L:K] = n$, so $B/mathfrak P =k(hatalpha) approx k(baralpha) = l.$
answered Sep 5 at 13:27
CYC
940711
940711
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
add a comment |Â
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
1
1
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
There are quite a few obscurities in your argument which I don't understand. First, why is $alpha$ in $B$? It is so only if you take a lift $g$ of $bar g$ which is monic. But this is a punctilious remark. My second objection is more serious. In my opinion, the proof in the first part of the answer of @pisco only shows that $A[alpha]$ , as a $mathbf Z$-module, has the same rank $n$ as $B$, i.e. the index $(B : A[alpha])$ is finite, but not automatically 1. To show equality, it will be crucial to know that $L/K$ is unramified ...
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:28
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
... as shown in your p.s. (= the second part of pisco's answer). For what follows, the main reference is SerreâÂÂs « Local Fields », chap.3, §§5-6. Write $C= A[alpha]$. On the one hand, in the general case, the different $mathfrak D_B/A$ divides $(gâÂÂ(alpha))$, and these two ideals are equal iff $B=C$ (§5, coroll. 2). On the other hand, the calculation of the different shows that $L/K$ is unramified iff $B=C$ (§6, lemma 3). This solves your problem.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 5 at 19:30
1
1
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo First, I missed a detail that $g$ is required to be monic, thanks for noting. Second, I don't use the conclusion of pisco's answer, only as a proof that $B$ is a generated by $alpha$ as an A-module,(For any $bin B$, since $b$ is in $L$, it is generated by $alpha$ with coefficients in $K$, then since $alpha$ has valuation $=0$, pico's work shows the result that each coefficient is in fact in $A$.), it follows $B=A[alpha]$.
â CYC
Sep 6 at 1:55
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
@nguyenquangdo $L/K$ is unramified follows from the assumption, and in my proof, I indeed used the extension is unramified. Also, I proved $B=A[alpha]$, not merely the same rank. Of course, your proof using different also sounds.
â pisco
Sep 6 at 4:09
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
Thanks for the clarifications. I missed the fact that $alpha$ is invertible, which explains the second (ex- first) part of pisco's answer. Everything's OK now.
â nguyen quang do
Sep 6 at 6:33
add a comment |Â
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