Prove or disprove $ A^4 + B^4 $ can be diagonalized
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Let $ A,B $ be two $ 3times3 $ matrices over $ mathbb R $ and $ A^t = -A, B^t = B $
I need to prove or disprove that $ A^4 + B^4 $ can be diagonalised over $ mathbb R $.
I really couldn't think of any direction to this. Any hints?
linear-algebra matrices diagonalization
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up vote
2
down vote
favorite
Let $ A,B $ be two $ 3times3 $ matrices over $ mathbb R $ and $ A^t = -A, B^t = B $
I need to prove or disprove that $ A^4 + B^4 $ can be diagonalised over $ mathbb R $.
I really couldn't think of any direction to this. Any hints?
linear-algebra matrices diagonalization
add a comment |Â
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
up vote
2
down vote
favorite
Let $ A,B $ be two $ 3times3 $ matrices over $ mathbb R $ and $ A^t = -A, B^t = B $
I need to prove or disprove that $ A^4 + B^4 $ can be diagonalised over $ mathbb R $.
I really couldn't think of any direction to this. Any hints?
linear-algebra matrices diagonalization
Let $ A,B $ be two $ 3times3 $ matrices over $ mathbb R $ and $ A^t = -A, B^t = B $
I need to prove or disprove that $ A^4 + B^4 $ can be diagonalised over $ mathbb R $.
I really couldn't think of any direction to this. Any hints?
linear-algebra matrices diagonalization
edited Aug 26 at 22:51
José Carlos Santos
119k16101182
119k16101182
asked Aug 26 at 22:20
bm1125
38016
38016
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add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
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up vote
5
down vote
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Hint: One of your matrices is skew-symmetric, whereas the other one is symmetric. Deduce from that fact that $A^4+B^4$ is symmetric and use that fact.
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Since
$A^T = -A, tag 1$
we have, for any $n in Bbb N$
$(A^2n)^T = (A^T)^2n = ((A^T)^2)^n = ((-A)^2)^n = (A^2)^n = A^2n; tag 2$
thus, $A^2n$ is symmetric; since
$B^T = B, tag 3$
we also have
$(B^2n)^T = (B^T)^2n = B^2n, tag 4$
so $B^2n$ is also symmetric; therefore
$(A^2n + B^2n)^T = (A^2n)^T + (B^2n)^T = A^2n + B^2n tag 5$
is symmetric as well for any $n in Bbb N$, hence diagonalizable over $Bbb R$.
Taking $n = 2$ yields the result required for the specific case at hand.
In the above we have used the general property that
$(C^T)^m = (C^m)^T tag 6$
for any $m in Bbb N$; this is easily seen by a simple induction: when $m = 2$, we have, since $(CD)^T = D^T C^T$ for any two square matrices of the same size,
$(C^T)^2 = C^T C^T = (CC)^T = (C^2)^T; tag 7$
now if
$(C^T)^k = (C^k)^T, tag 8$
then,
$(C^T)^k + 1 = C^T (C^T)^k = C^T(C^k)^T = (C^k C)^T = (C^k + 1)^T, tag 9$
completing the induction and finalizing our proof of (5).
Note that the hypothesis that $A, B$ are $3 times 3$ is not needed here; the rusult holds no matter what the size of $A$ and $B$ might be.
add a comment |Â
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
2 Answers
2
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
5
down vote
accepted
Hint: One of your matrices is skew-symmetric, whereas the other one is symmetric. Deduce from that fact that $A^4+B^4$ is symmetric and use that fact.
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
accepted
Hint: One of your matrices is skew-symmetric, whereas the other one is symmetric. Deduce from that fact that $A^4+B^4$ is symmetric and use that fact.
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
add a comment |Â
up vote
5
down vote
accepted
up vote
5
down vote
accepted
Hint: One of your matrices is skew-symmetric, whereas the other one is symmetric. Deduce from that fact that $A^4+B^4$ is symmetric and use that fact.
Hint: One of your matrices is skew-symmetric, whereas the other one is symmetric. Deduce from that fact that $A^4+B^4$ is symmetric and use that fact.
edited Aug 26 at 22:25
answered Aug 26 at 22:22
José Carlos Santos
119k16101182
119k16101182
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
add a comment |Â
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
$B$ is symmetric, not skew. (But the conclusion is the same).
â Henning Makholm
Aug 26 at 22:23
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
@HenningMakholm I've edited my answer. Thank you.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:26
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
Well I did find out that $ A^4 $ is symmetric and $ B^4 $ also symmetric because it's exchangeable and so $ A^4 + B^4 $ would be symmetric and so (according to some online paper) any symmetric matrix of n has exactly n eigenvalues , not necessarily distinct. Yet I haven't found in my books any proof for that if $ A^t = -A rightarrow A^2 = A^2^T $ and that any symmetric matrix has exactly n eigenvalues.
â bm1125
Aug 26 at 22:52
1
1
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
Sure, it may have repeated eigenvalues. Nevertheless, the spectral theorem says that every real symmetric matrix is diagonalizable.
â José Carlos Santos
Aug 26 at 22:56
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Since
$A^T = -A, tag 1$
we have, for any $n in Bbb N$
$(A^2n)^T = (A^T)^2n = ((A^T)^2)^n = ((-A)^2)^n = (A^2)^n = A^2n; tag 2$
thus, $A^2n$ is symmetric; since
$B^T = B, tag 3$
we also have
$(B^2n)^T = (B^T)^2n = B^2n, tag 4$
so $B^2n$ is also symmetric; therefore
$(A^2n + B^2n)^T = (A^2n)^T + (B^2n)^T = A^2n + B^2n tag 5$
is symmetric as well for any $n in Bbb N$, hence diagonalizable over $Bbb R$.
Taking $n = 2$ yields the result required for the specific case at hand.
In the above we have used the general property that
$(C^T)^m = (C^m)^T tag 6$
for any $m in Bbb N$; this is easily seen by a simple induction: when $m = 2$, we have, since $(CD)^T = D^T C^T$ for any two square matrices of the same size,
$(C^T)^2 = C^T C^T = (CC)^T = (C^2)^T; tag 7$
now if
$(C^T)^k = (C^k)^T, tag 8$
then,
$(C^T)^k + 1 = C^T (C^T)^k = C^T(C^k)^T = (C^k C)^T = (C^k + 1)^T, tag 9$
completing the induction and finalizing our proof of (5).
Note that the hypothesis that $A, B$ are $3 times 3$ is not needed here; the rusult holds no matter what the size of $A$ and $B$ might be.
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
Since
$A^T = -A, tag 1$
we have, for any $n in Bbb N$
$(A^2n)^T = (A^T)^2n = ((A^T)^2)^n = ((-A)^2)^n = (A^2)^n = A^2n; tag 2$
thus, $A^2n$ is symmetric; since
$B^T = B, tag 3$
we also have
$(B^2n)^T = (B^T)^2n = B^2n, tag 4$
so $B^2n$ is also symmetric; therefore
$(A^2n + B^2n)^T = (A^2n)^T + (B^2n)^T = A^2n + B^2n tag 5$
is symmetric as well for any $n in Bbb N$, hence diagonalizable over $Bbb R$.
Taking $n = 2$ yields the result required for the specific case at hand.
In the above we have used the general property that
$(C^T)^m = (C^m)^T tag 6$
for any $m in Bbb N$; this is easily seen by a simple induction: when $m = 2$, we have, since $(CD)^T = D^T C^T$ for any two square matrices of the same size,
$(C^T)^2 = C^T C^T = (CC)^T = (C^2)^T; tag 7$
now if
$(C^T)^k = (C^k)^T, tag 8$
then,
$(C^T)^k + 1 = C^T (C^T)^k = C^T(C^k)^T = (C^k C)^T = (C^k + 1)^T, tag 9$
completing the induction and finalizing our proof of (5).
Note that the hypothesis that $A, B$ are $3 times 3$ is not needed here; the rusult holds no matter what the size of $A$ and $B$ might be.
add a comment |Â
up vote
1
down vote
up vote
1
down vote
Since
$A^T = -A, tag 1$
we have, for any $n in Bbb N$
$(A^2n)^T = (A^T)^2n = ((A^T)^2)^n = ((-A)^2)^n = (A^2)^n = A^2n; tag 2$
thus, $A^2n$ is symmetric; since
$B^T = B, tag 3$
we also have
$(B^2n)^T = (B^T)^2n = B^2n, tag 4$
so $B^2n$ is also symmetric; therefore
$(A^2n + B^2n)^T = (A^2n)^T + (B^2n)^T = A^2n + B^2n tag 5$
is symmetric as well for any $n in Bbb N$, hence diagonalizable over $Bbb R$.
Taking $n = 2$ yields the result required for the specific case at hand.
In the above we have used the general property that
$(C^T)^m = (C^m)^T tag 6$
for any $m in Bbb N$; this is easily seen by a simple induction: when $m = 2$, we have, since $(CD)^T = D^T C^T$ for any two square matrices of the same size,
$(C^T)^2 = C^T C^T = (CC)^T = (C^2)^T; tag 7$
now if
$(C^T)^k = (C^k)^T, tag 8$
then,
$(C^T)^k + 1 = C^T (C^T)^k = C^T(C^k)^T = (C^k C)^T = (C^k + 1)^T, tag 9$
completing the induction and finalizing our proof of (5).
Note that the hypothesis that $A, B$ are $3 times 3$ is not needed here; the rusult holds no matter what the size of $A$ and $B$ might be.
Since
$A^T = -A, tag 1$
we have, for any $n in Bbb N$
$(A^2n)^T = (A^T)^2n = ((A^T)^2)^n = ((-A)^2)^n = (A^2)^n = A^2n; tag 2$
thus, $A^2n$ is symmetric; since
$B^T = B, tag 3$
we also have
$(B^2n)^T = (B^T)^2n = B^2n, tag 4$
so $B^2n$ is also symmetric; therefore
$(A^2n + B^2n)^T = (A^2n)^T + (B^2n)^T = A^2n + B^2n tag 5$
is symmetric as well for any $n in Bbb N$, hence diagonalizable over $Bbb R$.
Taking $n = 2$ yields the result required for the specific case at hand.
In the above we have used the general property that
$(C^T)^m = (C^m)^T tag 6$
for any $m in Bbb N$; this is easily seen by a simple induction: when $m = 2$, we have, since $(CD)^T = D^T C^T$ for any two square matrices of the same size,
$(C^T)^2 = C^T C^T = (CC)^T = (C^2)^T; tag 7$
now if
$(C^T)^k = (C^k)^T, tag 8$
then,
$(C^T)^k + 1 = C^T (C^T)^k = C^T(C^k)^T = (C^k C)^T = (C^k + 1)^T, tag 9$
completing the induction and finalizing our proof of (5).
Note that the hypothesis that $A, B$ are $3 times 3$ is not needed here; the rusult holds no matter what the size of $A$ and $B$ might be.
answered Aug 26 at 22:59
Robert Lewis
38k22357
38k22357
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