Limit of sequence exists but might be infinity

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Assumption 4.2 in Stokey et al. states, for the real sequence $x_t$:




... $lim_nrightarrow infty sum_t=0^n x_t$ exists but might be positive or negative infinity.




But this goes against my intuition and understanding.



How can a series going to $infty$ be converging to a limit? And what is the difference between converging to $infty$ and diverging?



Source: Stokey, N. & Lucas, R.(1989} Recursive Methods in Economic Dynamics, page 84










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  • the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:45











  • @Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:46










  • @Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
    – Hurkyl
    Sep 6 at 6:53














up vote
3
down vote

favorite












Assumption 4.2 in Stokey et al. states, for the real sequence $x_t$:




... $lim_nrightarrow infty sum_t=0^n x_t$ exists but might be positive or negative infinity.




But this goes against my intuition and understanding.



How can a series going to $infty$ be converging to a limit? And what is the difference between converging to $infty$ and diverging?



Source: Stokey, N. & Lucas, R.(1989} Recursive Methods in Economic Dynamics, page 84










share|cite|improve this question





















  • the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:45











  • @Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:46










  • @Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
    – Hurkyl
    Sep 6 at 6:53












up vote
3
down vote

favorite









up vote
3
down vote

favorite











Assumption 4.2 in Stokey et al. states, for the real sequence $x_t$:




... $lim_nrightarrow infty sum_t=0^n x_t$ exists but might be positive or negative infinity.




But this goes against my intuition and understanding.



How can a series going to $infty$ be converging to a limit? And what is the difference between converging to $infty$ and diverging?



Source: Stokey, N. & Lucas, R.(1989} Recursive Methods in Economic Dynamics, page 84










share|cite|improve this question













Assumption 4.2 in Stokey et al. states, for the real sequence $x_t$:




... $lim_nrightarrow infty sum_t=0^n x_t$ exists but might be positive or negative infinity.




But this goes against my intuition and understanding.



How can a series going to $infty$ be converging to a limit? And what is the difference between converging to $infty$ and diverging?



Source: Stokey, N. & Lucas, R.(1989} Recursive Methods in Economic Dynamics, page 84







sequences-and-series limits






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asked Sep 6 at 6:41









Chris tie

1303




1303











  • the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:45











  • @Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:46










  • @Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
    – Hurkyl
    Sep 6 at 6:53
















  • the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:45











  • @Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:46










  • @Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
    – Nosrati
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
    – Peter
    Sep 6 at 6:48










  • @Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
    – Hurkyl
    Sep 6 at 6:53















the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
– Nosrati
Sep 6 at 6:45





the limit $lim_xtoinfty x$ exists and is equal to $infty$. but what is the definition of convergence ?
– Nosrati
Sep 6 at 6:45













@Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
– Peter
Sep 6 at 6:46




@Nosrati This is a sloppy and mathematical incorrect formulation. $infty$ is not a number. Unfortunately, this formulation is however quite often used.
– Peter
Sep 6 at 6:46












@Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
– Nosrati
Sep 6 at 6:48




@Peter exactly. but generally the definition of convergence says the limit is exist and is finite.
– Nosrati
Sep 6 at 6:48












@Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
– Peter
Sep 6 at 6:48




@Nosrati Yes, that is of course correct.
– Peter
Sep 6 at 6:48












@Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
– Hurkyl
Sep 6 at 6:53




@Peter: There is nothing sloppy about the extended real number line.
– Hurkyl
Sep 6 at 6:53










3 Answers
3






active

oldest

votes

















up vote
3
down vote



accepted










This kind of definition is often used and we said that the limit of a sequences may



  • exist finite when $a_nto Lin mathbbR$ and $a_n$ converges


  • exist infinite positive $a_nto infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


  • exist infinite negative $a_nto -infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


  • doesn’t exist in all the other cases


Note that for the three cases of existence we need three different definitions.



The advantage of this kind of definition is that we distinguish the infinite cases from the last which is the case of sequences like $sin n$ for example.






share|cite|improve this answer



























    up vote
    1
    down vote













    There is no real difference between "diverges to $+infty$" and "converges to $+infty$"; the choice of language simply reflects the author's point of view.



    When doing calculus/real analysis, it is very convenient to work in the extended real numbers.



    $+infty$ and $-infty$ are points on the extended real line, and we can talk about limits involving them. we say $lim_n to +infty x_n = +infty$, this is just the ordinary (topological) definition of a limit. And the usual language for limits is that $x_n$ converges to the point $+infty$ as $n$ goes to $+infty$.



    Introductory calculus classes generally avoid talking about the extended real line. When restricting yourself just to the ordinary real line, such a limit doesn't converge to a point of the real line, so it would be correct to say such a limit does not exist.



    These limits, however, are so incredibly useful to know and understand that introductory calculus classes have to teach them, despite never talking about the extended real numbers.



    So you have the unfortunate situation where you still want to talk about limits that have infinite values, or whose argument goes to infinity, or both... but since you restrict yourself to a space that does not actually have the points at infinity you can't say these are convergent limits.



    In conclusion:



    • Saying the "limit exists and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking the limits in the extended real numbers

    • Saying the "limit does not exist and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking limits in the ordinary real numbers, but still finds this situation useful enough to talk about it anyways





    share|cite|improve this answer





























      up vote
      1
      down vote













      "Not converging" can have two meanings



      • diverging to $pminfty$,


      • not converging at all (f.i. with two subsequences that converge to different limits).


      The author probably wanted to express compactly that we are not in the second case.






      share|cite|improve this answer






















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        3 Answers
        3






        active

        oldest

        votes








        3 Answers
        3






        active

        oldest

        votes









        active

        oldest

        votes






        active

        oldest

        votes








        up vote
        3
        down vote



        accepted










        This kind of definition is often used and we said that the limit of a sequences may



        • exist finite when $a_nto Lin mathbbR$ and $a_n$ converges


        • exist infinite positive $a_nto infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


        • exist infinite negative $a_nto -infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


        • doesn’t exist in all the other cases


        Note that for the three cases of existence we need three different definitions.



        The advantage of this kind of definition is that we distinguish the infinite cases from the last which is the case of sequences like $sin n$ for example.






        share|cite|improve this answer
























          up vote
          3
          down vote



          accepted










          This kind of definition is often used and we said that the limit of a sequences may



          • exist finite when $a_nto Lin mathbbR$ and $a_n$ converges


          • exist infinite positive $a_nto infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


          • exist infinite negative $a_nto -infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


          • doesn’t exist in all the other cases


          Note that for the three cases of existence we need three different definitions.



          The advantage of this kind of definition is that we distinguish the infinite cases from the last which is the case of sequences like $sin n$ for example.






          share|cite|improve this answer






















            up vote
            3
            down vote



            accepted







            up vote
            3
            down vote



            accepted






            This kind of definition is often used and we said that the limit of a sequences may



            • exist finite when $a_nto Lin mathbbR$ and $a_n$ converges


            • exist infinite positive $a_nto infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


            • exist infinite negative $a_nto -infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


            • doesn’t exist in all the other cases


            Note that for the three cases of existence we need three different definitions.



            The advantage of this kind of definition is that we distinguish the infinite cases from the last which is the case of sequences like $sin n$ for example.






            share|cite|improve this answer












            This kind of definition is often used and we said that the limit of a sequences may



            • exist finite when $a_nto Lin mathbbR$ and $a_n$ converges


            • exist infinite positive $a_nto infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


            • exist infinite negative $a_nto -infty$ and $a_n$ diverges


            • doesn’t exist in all the other cases


            Note that for the three cases of existence we need three different definitions.



            The advantage of this kind of definition is that we distinguish the infinite cases from the last which is the case of sequences like $sin n$ for example.







            share|cite|improve this answer












            share|cite|improve this answer



            share|cite|improve this answer










            answered Sep 6 at 6:55









            gimusi

            73.6k73889




            73.6k73889




















                up vote
                1
                down vote













                There is no real difference between "diverges to $+infty$" and "converges to $+infty$"; the choice of language simply reflects the author's point of view.



                When doing calculus/real analysis, it is very convenient to work in the extended real numbers.



                $+infty$ and $-infty$ are points on the extended real line, and we can talk about limits involving them. we say $lim_n to +infty x_n = +infty$, this is just the ordinary (topological) definition of a limit. And the usual language for limits is that $x_n$ converges to the point $+infty$ as $n$ goes to $+infty$.



                Introductory calculus classes generally avoid talking about the extended real line. When restricting yourself just to the ordinary real line, such a limit doesn't converge to a point of the real line, so it would be correct to say such a limit does not exist.



                These limits, however, are so incredibly useful to know and understand that introductory calculus classes have to teach them, despite never talking about the extended real numbers.



                So you have the unfortunate situation where you still want to talk about limits that have infinite values, or whose argument goes to infinity, or both... but since you restrict yourself to a space that does not actually have the points at infinity you can't say these are convergent limits.



                In conclusion:



                • Saying the "limit exists and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking the limits in the extended real numbers

                • Saying the "limit does not exist and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking limits in the ordinary real numbers, but still finds this situation useful enough to talk about it anyways





                share|cite|improve this answer


























                  up vote
                  1
                  down vote













                  There is no real difference between "diverges to $+infty$" and "converges to $+infty$"; the choice of language simply reflects the author's point of view.



                  When doing calculus/real analysis, it is very convenient to work in the extended real numbers.



                  $+infty$ and $-infty$ are points on the extended real line, and we can talk about limits involving them. we say $lim_n to +infty x_n = +infty$, this is just the ordinary (topological) definition of a limit. And the usual language for limits is that $x_n$ converges to the point $+infty$ as $n$ goes to $+infty$.



                  Introductory calculus classes generally avoid talking about the extended real line. When restricting yourself just to the ordinary real line, such a limit doesn't converge to a point of the real line, so it would be correct to say such a limit does not exist.



                  These limits, however, are so incredibly useful to know and understand that introductory calculus classes have to teach them, despite never talking about the extended real numbers.



                  So you have the unfortunate situation where you still want to talk about limits that have infinite values, or whose argument goes to infinity, or both... but since you restrict yourself to a space that does not actually have the points at infinity you can't say these are convergent limits.



                  In conclusion:



                  • Saying the "limit exists and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking the limits in the extended real numbers

                  • Saying the "limit does not exist and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking limits in the ordinary real numbers, but still finds this situation useful enough to talk about it anyways





                  share|cite|improve this answer
























                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote









                    There is no real difference between "diverges to $+infty$" and "converges to $+infty$"; the choice of language simply reflects the author's point of view.



                    When doing calculus/real analysis, it is very convenient to work in the extended real numbers.



                    $+infty$ and $-infty$ are points on the extended real line, and we can talk about limits involving them. we say $lim_n to +infty x_n = +infty$, this is just the ordinary (topological) definition of a limit. And the usual language for limits is that $x_n$ converges to the point $+infty$ as $n$ goes to $+infty$.



                    Introductory calculus classes generally avoid talking about the extended real line. When restricting yourself just to the ordinary real line, such a limit doesn't converge to a point of the real line, so it would be correct to say such a limit does not exist.



                    These limits, however, are so incredibly useful to know and understand that introductory calculus classes have to teach them, despite never talking about the extended real numbers.



                    So you have the unfortunate situation where you still want to talk about limits that have infinite values, or whose argument goes to infinity, or both... but since you restrict yourself to a space that does not actually have the points at infinity you can't say these are convergent limits.



                    In conclusion:



                    • Saying the "limit exists and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking the limits in the extended real numbers

                    • Saying the "limit does not exist and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking limits in the ordinary real numbers, but still finds this situation useful enough to talk about it anyways





                    share|cite|improve this answer














                    There is no real difference between "diverges to $+infty$" and "converges to $+infty$"; the choice of language simply reflects the author's point of view.



                    When doing calculus/real analysis, it is very convenient to work in the extended real numbers.



                    $+infty$ and $-infty$ are points on the extended real line, and we can talk about limits involving them. we say $lim_n to +infty x_n = +infty$, this is just the ordinary (topological) definition of a limit. And the usual language for limits is that $x_n$ converges to the point $+infty$ as $n$ goes to $+infty$.



                    Introductory calculus classes generally avoid talking about the extended real line. When restricting yourself just to the ordinary real line, such a limit doesn't converge to a point of the real line, so it would be correct to say such a limit does not exist.



                    These limits, however, are so incredibly useful to know and understand that introductory calculus classes have to teach them, despite never talking about the extended real numbers.



                    So you have the unfortunate situation where you still want to talk about limits that have infinite values, or whose argument goes to infinity, or both... but since you restrict yourself to a space that does not actually have the points at infinity you can't say these are convergent limits.



                    In conclusion:



                    • Saying the "limit exists and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking the limits in the extended real numbers

                    • Saying the "limit does not exist and has value $+infty$" means the author is thinking of taking limits in the ordinary real numbers, but still finds this situation useful enough to talk about it anyways






                    share|cite|improve this answer














                    share|cite|improve this answer



                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    edited Sep 6 at 7:11

























                    answered Sep 6 at 6:57









                    Hurkyl

                    110k9114257




                    110k9114257




















                        up vote
                        1
                        down vote













                        "Not converging" can have two meanings



                        • diverging to $pminfty$,


                        • not converging at all (f.i. with two subsequences that converge to different limits).


                        The author probably wanted to express compactly that we are not in the second case.






                        share|cite|improve this answer


























                          up vote
                          1
                          down vote













                          "Not converging" can have two meanings



                          • diverging to $pminfty$,


                          • not converging at all (f.i. with two subsequences that converge to different limits).


                          The author probably wanted to express compactly that we are not in the second case.






                          share|cite|improve this answer
























                            up vote
                            1
                            down vote










                            up vote
                            1
                            down vote









                            "Not converging" can have two meanings



                            • diverging to $pminfty$,


                            • not converging at all (f.i. with two subsequences that converge to different limits).


                            The author probably wanted to express compactly that we are not in the second case.






                            share|cite|improve this answer














                            "Not converging" can have two meanings



                            • diverging to $pminfty$,


                            • not converging at all (f.i. with two subsequences that converge to different limits).


                            The author probably wanted to express compactly that we are not in the second case.







                            share|cite|improve this answer














                            share|cite|improve this answer



                            share|cite|improve this answer








                            edited Sep 6 at 7:28

























                            answered Sep 6 at 7:23









                            Yves Daoust

                            115k666209




                            115k666209



























                                 

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