Isomorphism of inverse limits.

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Let $R$ be a commutative ring, $mathcalM_R$ the set of monic polynomials in $R[q]$, $M subset mathcalM_R$ and $M^*$ the multiplicative closed set associated to $M$. Order the polynomials in $M^*$ by divisibility. Then, $$left(R[q]/(f_i), f_ij right)$$
is an inverse system of rings and we can take the inverse limit
$$R[q]^M = varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)$$
On the other hand, for a fixed $M subset mathcalM_R$, let
$$mathcalS_R = M'$$
If $M' subset M$ we have a natural map
$$mu_M',M colon R[q]^M to R[q]^M'$$
Hence, the sets in $mathcalS_R$ along with the maps $mu_M'',M' colon R[q]^M' to R[q]^M''$ form an inverse system of rings, so we can take the inverse limit
$$R[q]^S = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R R[q]^M'$$




Why is $R[q]^M cong R[q]^S$?




Intuitively it seems so, since
$$R[q]^s = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_RR[q]^M' = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)$$
but I have not been able to prove it. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.



UPDATE: I believe I came up with an answer but I'm not sure if it works. I assume that $R[q]^S$ can be written as
$$R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in AR[q]/(f)$$
where
$$A = M'$$
so I tried to show that $A$ is cofinal in $M^*$. I need to prove that for any $f in M^*$ there is some $overlineƒ$ such that $overlinefin (M')^*$ for some $M' subset M$ with $|M'|<infty$. Let $f in M^*$, then
$$f = prod_i in I f_i^n_i$$
where each $f_i in M$. Consider any $i_0 in I$ and $M' = f_i_0 subset M$ which is finite. Then the same polynomial $f_i_0$ works as the $overlinef$ in the definition, and creamy $f_i_0 vert f$. Therefore $A subset M^*$ is cofinal so both inverse limits are isomorphic. The problem is then the fact that I'm not entirely sure that $R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in A R[q]/(f)$.







share|cite|improve this question


























    up vote
    2
    down vote

    favorite












    Let $R$ be a commutative ring, $mathcalM_R$ the set of monic polynomials in $R[q]$, $M subset mathcalM_R$ and $M^*$ the multiplicative closed set associated to $M$. Order the polynomials in $M^*$ by divisibility. Then, $$left(R[q]/(f_i), f_ij right)$$
    is an inverse system of rings and we can take the inverse limit
    $$R[q]^M = varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)$$
    On the other hand, for a fixed $M subset mathcalM_R$, let
    $$mathcalS_R = M'$$
    If $M' subset M$ we have a natural map
    $$mu_M',M colon R[q]^M to R[q]^M'$$
    Hence, the sets in $mathcalS_R$ along with the maps $mu_M'',M' colon R[q]^M' to R[q]^M''$ form an inverse system of rings, so we can take the inverse limit
    $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R R[q]^M'$$




    Why is $R[q]^M cong R[q]^S$?




    Intuitively it seems so, since
    $$R[q]^s = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_RR[q]^M' = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)$$
    but I have not been able to prove it. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.



    UPDATE: I believe I came up with an answer but I'm not sure if it works. I assume that $R[q]^S$ can be written as
    $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in AR[q]/(f)$$
    where
    $$A = M'$$
    so I tried to show that $A$ is cofinal in $M^*$. I need to prove that for any $f in M^*$ there is some $overlineƒ$ such that $overlinefin (M')^*$ for some $M' subset M$ with $|M'|<infty$. Let $f in M^*$, then
    $$f = prod_i in I f_i^n_i$$
    where each $f_i in M$. Consider any $i_0 in I$ and $M' = f_i_0 subset M$ which is finite. Then the same polynomial $f_i_0$ works as the $overlinef$ in the definition, and creamy $f_i_0 vert f$. Therefore $A subset M^*$ is cofinal so both inverse limits are isomorphic. The problem is then the fact that I'm not entirely sure that $R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in A R[q]/(f)$.







    share|cite|improve this question
























      up vote
      2
      down vote

      favorite









      up vote
      2
      down vote

      favorite











      Let $R$ be a commutative ring, $mathcalM_R$ the set of monic polynomials in $R[q]$, $M subset mathcalM_R$ and $M^*$ the multiplicative closed set associated to $M$. Order the polynomials in $M^*$ by divisibility. Then, $$left(R[q]/(f_i), f_ij right)$$
      is an inverse system of rings and we can take the inverse limit
      $$R[q]^M = varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)$$
      On the other hand, for a fixed $M subset mathcalM_R$, let
      $$mathcalS_R = M'$$
      If $M' subset M$ we have a natural map
      $$mu_M',M colon R[q]^M to R[q]^M'$$
      Hence, the sets in $mathcalS_R$ along with the maps $mu_M'',M' colon R[q]^M' to R[q]^M''$ form an inverse system of rings, so we can take the inverse limit
      $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R R[q]^M'$$




      Why is $R[q]^M cong R[q]^S$?




      Intuitively it seems so, since
      $$R[q]^s = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_RR[q]^M' = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)$$
      but I have not been able to prove it. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.



      UPDATE: I believe I came up with an answer but I'm not sure if it works. I assume that $R[q]^S$ can be written as
      $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in AR[q]/(f)$$
      where
      $$A = M'$$
      so I tried to show that $A$ is cofinal in $M^*$. I need to prove that for any $f in M^*$ there is some $overlineƒ$ such that $overlinefin (M')^*$ for some $M' subset M$ with $|M'|<infty$. Let $f in M^*$, then
      $$f = prod_i in I f_i^n_i$$
      where each $f_i in M$. Consider any $i_0 in I$ and $M' = f_i_0 subset M$ which is finite. Then the same polynomial $f_i_0$ works as the $overlinef$ in the definition, and creamy $f_i_0 vert f$. Therefore $A subset M^*$ is cofinal so both inverse limits are isomorphic. The problem is then the fact that I'm not entirely sure that $R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in A R[q]/(f)$.







      share|cite|improve this question














      Let $R$ be a commutative ring, $mathcalM_R$ the set of monic polynomials in $R[q]$, $M subset mathcalM_R$ and $M^*$ the multiplicative closed set associated to $M$. Order the polynomials in $M^*$ by divisibility. Then, $$left(R[q]/(f_i), f_ij right)$$
      is an inverse system of rings and we can take the inverse limit
      $$R[q]^M = varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)$$
      On the other hand, for a fixed $M subset mathcalM_R$, let
      $$mathcalS_R = M'$$
      If $M' subset M$ we have a natural map
      $$mu_M',M colon R[q]^M to R[q]^M'$$
      Hence, the sets in $mathcalS_R$ along with the maps $mu_M'',M' colon R[q]^M' to R[q]^M''$ form an inverse system of rings, so we can take the inverse limit
      $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R R[q]^M'$$




      Why is $R[q]^M cong R[q]^S$?




      Intuitively it seems so, since
      $$R[q]^s = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_RR[q]^M' = varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)$$
      but I have not been able to prove it. Any help would be appreciated. Thank you.



      UPDATE: I believe I came up with an answer but I'm not sure if it works. I assume that $R[q]^S$ can be written as
      $$R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in AR[q]/(f)$$
      where
      $$A = M'$$
      so I tried to show that $A$ is cofinal in $M^*$. I need to prove that for any $f in M^*$ there is some $overlineƒ$ such that $overlinefin (M')^*$ for some $M' subset M$ with $|M'|<infty$. Let $f in M^*$, then
      $$f = prod_i in I f_i^n_i$$
      where each $f_i in M$. Consider any $i_0 in I$ and $M' = f_i_0 subset M$ which is finite. Then the same polynomial $f_i_0$ works as the $overlinef$ in the definition, and creamy $f_i_0 vert f$. Therefore $A subset M^*$ is cofinal so both inverse limits are isomorphic. The problem is then the fact that I'm not entirely sure that $R[q]^S = varprojlim_f in A R[q]/(f)$.









      share|cite|improve this question













      share|cite|improve this question




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      edited Mar 29 at 17:20

























      asked Mar 15 at 20:31









      user313212

      372519




      372519




















          2 Answers
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          active

          oldest

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          up vote
          1
          down vote



          accepted
          +100










          Someone might want to translate this into ring-theoretic terms, but to expand on Damien L's pos(e)t, let



          • $mathcal P$ be the poset category with objects polynomials $f$ in $M^*$ and with morphisms $f_1 to f_2$ iff $f_1mid f_2$


          • $mathcal Q$ be the poset category with objects are pairs $(f,M')$ such that $fin M'inmathcal S_R$ and with morphisms $(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')$ iff $f_1mid f_2$ and $M'subseteq M''$


          (I.e. $mathcal Q$ agrees with $B$.) Consider the diagrams $$X:mathcal P^textopto textbfRingtext mapping leftf_1to f_2rightoversetXlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ $$Y:mathcal Q^textopto textbfRingtext mapping left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetYlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ Where $R/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)$ is in both cases the obvious quotient morphism. By definition of $X$ and $Y$, $$lim X=varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)=R[q]^M$$ $$lim Y=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)=R[q]^S$$ Now consider the functor $F:mathcal Qto mathcal P$ mapping $left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetFlongmapsto leftf_1to f_2right$, and observe the natural isomorphism $$Xcirc F^textopsimeq Y$$ (They're the exact same map.) Furthermore $F$'s fullness and essential surjectivity imply the equivalence of the images of $Xcirc F^textop$ and $X$. (The two actually turn out to be the exact same.) If follows that $$lim Xcong lim Xcirc F^textopcong lim Y$$ As desired $blacksquare$



          Note that the "fullness and essential surjectivity" of $F$ follows from the fact that for any two $f_1,f_2in M^*$ for which $f_1mid f_2$, one may choose an $M'in mathcal S_R$ such that $f_1,f_2in M'$. Some care is also required in justifying $$varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)$$ The main idea is to describe a natural bijection between cones over the former diagram and those over the latter. (Drawing a picture helps.)






          share|cite|improve this answer



























            up vote
            1
            down vote













            I think you have the correct intuition, here is a hint following your update. Instead of using $A$, try using the poset $B$:
            $$
            B = M'
            $$
            where the poset structure is given by $(f, M') leq (g, M'')$ whenever $f mid g$ and $M' subset M''$.






            share|cite|improve this answer






















            • Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
              – user313212
              Aug 9 at 8:51










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            2 Answers
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            2 Answers
            2






            active

            oldest

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            active

            oldest

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            active

            oldest

            votes








            up vote
            1
            down vote



            accepted
            +100










            Someone might want to translate this into ring-theoretic terms, but to expand on Damien L's pos(e)t, let



            • $mathcal P$ be the poset category with objects polynomials $f$ in $M^*$ and with morphisms $f_1 to f_2$ iff $f_1mid f_2$


            • $mathcal Q$ be the poset category with objects are pairs $(f,M')$ such that $fin M'inmathcal S_R$ and with morphisms $(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')$ iff $f_1mid f_2$ and $M'subseteq M''$


            (I.e. $mathcal Q$ agrees with $B$.) Consider the diagrams $$X:mathcal P^textopto textbfRingtext mapping leftf_1to f_2rightoversetXlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ $$Y:mathcal Q^textopto textbfRingtext mapping left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetYlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ Where $R/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)$ is in both cases the obvious quotient morphism. By definition of $X$ and $Y$, $$lim X=varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)=R[q]^M$$ $$lim Y=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)=R[q]^S$$ Now consider the functor $F:mathcal Qto mathcal P$ mapping $left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetFlongmapsto leftf_1to f_2right$, and observe the natural isomorphism $$Xcirc F^textopsimeq Y$$ (They're the exact same map.) Furthermore $F$'s fullness and essential surjectivity imply the equivalence of the images of $Xcirc F^textop$ and $X$. (The two actually turn out to be the exact same.) If follows that $$lim Xcong lim Xcirc F^textopcong lim Y$$ As desired $blacksquare$



            Note that the "fullness and essential surjectivity" of $F$ follows from the fact that for any two $f_1,f_2in M^*$ for which $f_1mid f_2$, one may choose an $M'in mathcal S_R$ such that $f_1,f_2in M'$. Some care is also required in justifying $$varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)$$ The main idea is to describe a natural bijection between cones over the former diagram and those over the latter. (Drawing a picture helps.)






            share|cite|improve this answer
























              up vote
              1
              down vote



              accepted
              +100










              Someone might want to translate this into ring-theoretic terms, but to expand on Damien L's pos(e)t, let



              • $mathcal P$ be the poset category with objects polynomials $f$ in $M^*$ and with morphisms $f_1 to f_2$ iff $f_1mid f_2$


              • $mathcal Q$ be the poset category with objects are pairs $(f,M')$ such that $fin M'inmathcal S_R$ and with morphisms $(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')$ iff $f_1mid f_2$ and $M'subseteq M''$


              (I.e. $mathcal Q$ agrees with $B$.) Consider the diagrams $$X:mathcal P^textopto textbfRingtext mapping leftf_1to f_2rightoversetXlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ $$Y:mathcal Q^textopto textbfRingtext mapping left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetYlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ Where $R/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)$ is in both cases the obvious quotient morphism. By definition of $X$ and $Y$, $$lim X=varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)=R[q]^M$$ $$lim Y=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)=R[q]^S$$ Now consider the functor $F:mathcal Qto mathcal P$ mapping $left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetFlongmapsto leftf_1to f_2right$, and observe the natural isomorphism $$Xcirc F^textopsimeq Y$$ (They're the exact same map.) Furthermore $F$'s fullness and essential surjectivity imply the equivalence of the images of $Xcirc F^textop$ and $X$. (The two actually turn out to be the exact same.) If follows that $$lim Xcong lim Xcirc F^textopcong lim Y$$ As desired $blacksquare$



              Note that the "fullness and essential surjectivity" of $F$ follows from the fact that for any two $f_1,f_2in M^*$ for which $f_1mid f_2$, one may choose an $M'in mathcal S_R$ such that $f_1,f_2in M'$. Some care is also required in justifying $$varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)$$ The main idea is to describe a natural bijection between cones over the former diagram and those over the latter. (Drawing a picture helps.)






              share|cite|improve this answer






















                up vote
                1
                down vote



                accepted
                +100







                up vote
                1
                down vote



                accepted
                +100




                +100




                Someone might want to translate this into ring-theoretic terms, but to expand on Damien L's pos(e)t, let



                • $mathcal P$ be the poset category with objects polynomials $f$ in $M^*$ and with morphisms $f_1 to f_2$ iff $f_1mid f_2$


                • $mathcal Q$ be the poset category with objects are pairs $(f,M')$ such that $fin M'inmathcal S_R$ and with morphisms $(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')$ iff $f_1mid f_2$ and $M'subseteq M''$


                (I.e. $mathcal Q$ agrees with $B$.) Consider the diagrams $$X:mathcal P^textopto textbfRingtext mapping leftf_1to f_2rightoversetXlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ $$Y:mathcal Q^textopto textbfRingtext mapping left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetYlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ Where $R/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)$ is in both cases the obvious quotient morphism. By definition of $X$ and $Y$, $$lim X=varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)=R[q]^M$$ $$lim Y=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)=R[q]^S$$ Now consider the functor $F:mathcal Qto mathcal P$ mapping $left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetFlongmapsto leftf_1to f_2right$, and observe the natural isomorphism $$Xcirc F^textopsimeq Y$$ (They're the exact same map.) Furthermore $F$'s fullness and essential surjectivity imply the equivalence of the images of $Xcirc F^textop$ and $X$. (The two actually turn out to be the exact same.) If follows that $$lim Xcong lim Xcirc F^textopcong lim Y$$ As desired $blacksquare$



                Note that the "fullness and essential surjectivity" of $F$ follows from the fact that for any two $f_1,f_2in M^*$ for which $f_1mid f_2$, one may choose an $M'in mathcal S_R$ such that $f_1,f_2in M'$. Some care is also required in justifying $$varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)$$ The main idea is to describe a natural bijection between cones over the former diagram and those over the latter. (Drawing a picture helps.)






                share|cite|improve this answer












                Someone might want to translate this into ring-theoretic terms, but to expand on Damien L's pos(e)t, let



                • $mathcal P$ be the poset category with objects polynomials $f$ in $M^*$ and with morphisms $f_1 to f_2$ iff $f_1mid f_2$


                • $mathcal Q$ be the poset category with objects are pairs $(f,M')$ such that $fin M'inmathcal S_R$ and with morphisms $(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')$ iff $f_1mid f_2$ and $M'subseteq M''$


                (I.e. $mathcal Q$ agrees with $B$.) Consider the diagrams $$X:mathcal P^textopto textbfRingtext mapping leftf_1to f_2rightoversetXlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ $$Y:mathcal Q^textopto textbfRingtext mapping left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetYlongmapsto leftR/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)right$$ Where $R/(f_1)leftarrow R/(f_2)$ is in both cases the obvious quotient morphism. By definition of $X$ and $Y$, $$lim X=varprojlim_f in M^*R[q]/(f)=R[q]^M$$ $$lim Y=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)=R[q]^S$$ Now consider the functor $F:mathcal Qto mathcal P$ mapping $left(f_1,M')to (f_2,M'')rightoversetFlongmapsto leftf_1to f_2right$, and observe the natural isomorphism $$Xcirc F^textopsimeq Y$$ (They're the exact same map.) Furthermore $F$'s fullness and essential surjectivity imply the equivalence of the images of $Xcirc F^textop$ and $X$. (The two actually turn out to be the exact same.) If follows that $$lim Xcong lim Xcirc F^textopcong lim Y$$ As desired $blacksquare$



                Note that the "fullness and essential surjectivity" of $F$ follows from the fact that for any two $f_1,f_2in M^*$ for which $f_1mid f_2$, one may choose an $M'in mathcal S_R$ such that $f_1,f_2in M'$. Some care is also required in justifying $$varprojlim_M' in mathcalS_R left( varprojlim_f in (M')^* R[q]/(f) right)=varprojlim_fin (M')^*, M' in mathcalS_R R[q]/(f)$$ The main idea is to describe a natural bijection between cones over the former diagram and those over the latter. (Drawing a picture helps.)







                share|cite|improve this answer












                share|cite|improve this answer



                share|cite|improve this answer










                answered Aug 26 at 18:37









                Rafay A.

                3765




                3765




















                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote













                    I think you have the correct intuition, here is a hint following your update. Instead of using $A$, try using the poset $B$:
                    $$
                    B = M'
                    $$
                    where the poset structure is given by $(f, M') leq (g, M'')$ whenever $f mid g$ and $M' subset M''$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer






















                    • Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                      – user313212
                      Aug 9 at 8:51














                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote













                    I think you have the correct intuition, here is a hint following your update. Instead of using $A$, try using the poset $B$:
                    $$
                    B = M'
                    $$
                    where the poset structure is given by $(f, M') leq (g, M'')$ whenever $f mid g$ and $M' subset M''$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer






















                    • Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                      – user313212
                      Aug 9 at 8:51












                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote










                    up vote
                    1
                    down vote









                    I think you have the correct intuition, here is a hint following your update. Instead of using $A$, try using the poset $B$:
                    $$
                    B = M'
                    $$
                    where the poset structure is given by $(f, M') leq (g, M'')$ whenever $f mid g$ and $M' subset M''$.






                    share|cite|improve this answer














                    I think you have the correct intuition, here is a hint following your update. Instead of using $A$, try using the poset $B$:
                    $$
                    B = M'
                    $$
                    where the poset structure is given by $(f, M') leq (g, M'')$ whenever $f mid g$ and $M' subset M''$.







                    share|cite|improve this answer














                    share|cite|improve this answer



                    share|cite|improve this answer








                    edited Apr 3 at 1:57

























                    answered Apr 3 at 1:38









                    Damien L

                    4,929833




                    4,929833











                    • Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                      – user313212
                      Aug 9 at 8:51
















                    • Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                      – user313212
                      Aug 9 at 8:51















                    Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                    – user313212
                    Aug 9 at 8:51




                    Sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I have been thinking about your hint but I can't use any cofinality argument to prove the isomorphism. Could you elaborate a bit more? Thank you.
                    – user313212
                    Aug 9 at 8:51

















                     

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